if yer asking for an oppinion here is it. Not that it is going to carry much weight.
First I read the add. Fairly COMMON explination of things offered. As for if it was OOP from the add this was the buyers resposibility to find out.
The example I'm going to give: I recently was looking for some Dark Reaper figures for my new Eldar army as I'm just getting back into 40K. Since the GW site basiclly sucks I couldn't jsut go on and look at models. They are slowly filling in areas but many are still blank in the Eldar section (for individual models, boxed sets are easy to find)
As i scoured the posts I came across many "previous edition, Classic, and Older" models. As I wanted Specific ones (on the GW site labled as "classic") I sent to each trader a inquiry and a pic to find out if those were the ones i wanted. I was finally able to track down the ones I wanted.
Second When I am asking about condition, in no way does that mean Edition to me, that is a separate question. Condition is MIB, NIB, NOS, primed, ect...
Third, As I've got several armies, and one of my first trades here was my Tomb Kings Army for my Eldar Army. I hadn't touched my TK army since i purchased it except for one unit of foot soldiers and a unit of chariots. As far as I knew those were the most recent, I did a little bit of research but couldn't find any difference. Doesn't mean I didn't miss something.
On the Devils Advocate side
A person with 500 references should be an expert as posting and the posts should be short and descriptive. With over 250 successfull good trades you've had time to refine it.
Personally I'd be angry about the mis-shipping charges, it really isn't that hard to get postage rates, and with that many trades (lets say only 1/4 are them sending things) packages should be a "duh, by now you should know you can't send envelopes priority with DC"
There is more, but to sum it up Both sides screwed up, both sides are angry for percieved wrong-doings. But Both sides screwed up. Both of you take this as a lession for next time.
Problem: Recieving OOP VS New
Moderator: Moderators
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mrrshann618 ( 212 )
- Expert Trader
- Posts: 626
- Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 1:16 pm
- Location: Minnesota, USA
oppinion
For every battle honor, a thousand heroes die alone, unsung and unremembered.
"Condition" to me, means: Assembled or unassembled, painted or bare metal/ plastic, in box or out of box, on sprue or off sprue.
Had you asked me about the condition of something, I never would have thought to mention the edition. Then again, I would have had that in the original post.
I will say this though. With games that have been supported for the last 20+ years, it is difficult to keep track of every new item. GW's habit of not updating their site with the contents doesn't help the situation.
I just ran into a situation where a trader asked me if my Ezekial and Azrael were the current editions. I thought he was nuts, but happily noted that I was not aware of any new sculpts. He enlightened me to the fact that there were not new sculpts of the characters, but there were new back packs and what not that were more detailed (Hence current edition). I had no idea and am still trying to figure out the answer to his question. In other words, stuff happens and people goof.
I think the two of you need to discuss fixing this to a point that is the most beneficial to both of you.
1) No FB for either of you.
2) Since seller shipped at a much lower than quoted rate, seller can use the leftover shipping $ to pay to get them back.
3) Unless the seller only accepted MO, I don't see it as the seller's rresponsibility to refund the MO fee. You're gonna have to suck that one up man.
4) Unless there was mention of a restocking fee, it wasn't part of the deal so should not be incurred. If it was stated up front then it's tough titty ta ta for the buyer. Deal's a deal...
My $.02
Had you asked me about the condition of something, I never would have thought to mention the edition. Then again, I would have had that in the original post.
I will say this though. With games that have been supported for the last 20+ years, it is difficult to keep track of every new item. GW's habit of not updating their site with the contents doesn't help the situation.
I just ran into a situation where a trader asked me if my Ezekial and Azrael were the current editions. I thought he was nuts, but happily noted that I was not aware of any new sculpts. He enlightened me to the fact that there were not new sculpts of the characters, but there were new back packs and what not that were more detailed (Hence current edition). I had no idea and am still trying to figure out the answer to his question. In other words, stuff happens and people goof.
I think the two of you need to discuss fixing this to a point that is the most beneficial to both of you.
1) No FB for either of you.
2) Since seller shipped at a much lower than quoted rate, seller can use the leftover shipping $ to pay to get them back.
3) Unless the seller only accepted MO, I don't see it as the seller's rresponsibility to refund the MO fee. You're gonna have to suck that one up man.
4) Unless there was mention of a restocking fee, it wasn't part of the deal so should not be incurred. If it was stated up front then it's tough titty ta ta for the buyer. Deal's a deal...
My $.02
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MagickalMemories ( 832 )
- Lord Logorrheic!
- Posts: 16741
- Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:38 pm
- Location: St. Louis, MO - USA
Darksoul, KBolster, Ancient, Flagg & Sandy...
With exception of the traders listed above, the comments in this thread make me not want to trade anymore.
Holy cr@p, people. This is Bartertown... We're supposed to come here to trade stuff IN GOOD FAITH with each other. In such a utopian society, "Buyer Beware" is unnecessary, as the SELLER makes sure to note ALL INFO.
It's called being a good seller (no offense, DarkSoul... I'll touch on this again later. PLEASE wait until you read the rest of my post).
Those of you who say it is the buyers RESPONSIBILITY to ask all of the specifics of a model are DEAD WRONG.
It is the SELLERS job to ACCURATELY DESCRIBE the item(s) they are selling.
Now, a trader who has been burned, taken, misled, or made mistakes... or one who is sceptical by nature (all me)... will automatically ask certain questions. That is a good buyer habit... but should, most definitely, NOT be assumed to be his/her responsibility.
To those who say it IS his responsibility, I offer the following scenario. Interpreting your thoughts STRICTLY, the seller would NOT be in the wrong here (keep in mind, I am aware that I am overdoing it... but the fact is that it fits your specifics.
Seller has:
3 (10 man) squads (newest edition) of IG Cadians,cleaned of flash, unassembled & primed black. Primer is NOT globbed or runny. Each squad contains the complete pieces for 1 sgt (c-sword & laspistol), 8 las troops & 1 grenade launcher.
1 GW Bloodthirster in box (newest edition, box contents are complete)
1 Converted Eldar Avatar (assembled cleanly and primed, no thick glue, no flash lines)-- converted to hold 2 swords (no other conversions), Cityfight rubble decorated base.
It just so happens that you are looking for all of these items. You contact the seller (180 rating). He has no camera, but describes the models to you to the extent above. He mentions nothing exceptional about them... he goes into a lot of detail. Nothing seems amiss. Everything seems fine.
You get the models after sending him whatever you bought/traded for them.
You discover that:
The 3 (10 man) squads (newest edition) of IG Cadians ARE unassembled...
... but they USED to be assembled and painted. He took them apart and primed the pieces black. Since they were described as unassembled and primed, you didn't think to ask if they had ever been assembled, or if the primer was sprayed OVER old paint.... and he never said it WASN'T.
...and there are no bases. The descriptions say that he has the pieces for the MODELS. NOT the bases... and he doesn't consider the BASE as part of the model (many gamers, like myself, don't).
To put the icing on the cake, the OLD GLUE REMNANTS were left in place before priming and are still there
The Bloodthirster? Oh. You're gonna LOVE this.
It IS the newest one... and it IS in the box... it's even COMPLETE... Of course, it's poorly painted and scratched up. He yanked off the wings and base (it's present, because the ad said the box set was COMPLETE), and crammed the pieces in the B-Thirster box without padding it or anything.... He never said it was NEW in box.
The Avatar has TWO LEFT HANDS (or right hands... whichever holds the sword). The model is well put together. In fact, except for the hand thing, it would qualify as professionally assembled. It's pinned, GSed, the whole deal. Even the base looks nice.
Is the seller wrong??? Or, should the buyer have made sure to ask if "unassembled" meant that they were once assembled, then ripped apart? Should he have asked if "complete pieces" included the base? Should he have asked if "in box" meant that the thing was assembled, painted poorly, used, ripped apart, then crammed into the old box? Should he have asked if the swords were in the appropriate hand for the arm that hand was attached to?
Stupid buyer. It was his fault.
Come on, people. It is the SELLER'S RESPONSIBILITY to accurately list his items. It is POOR TRADE PRACTICE to leave things off and claim "Buyer Beware" if the guy was honest enough to presume that you would be honest, too.
Those out there screaming "Buyer Beware" make me wonder about THEIR trade practices.
No insult intended, but it's a pretty cr@ppy thing to blame the buyer.
Back to DarkSoul.
First off... I'd still trade with you. I don't think you did anything WRONG, per se. I just think you made a mistake. It's cool. We all do it.
Pobody's Nerfect.
I think that offering to refund his money (except shipping) is the right thing to do... but I think YOU should cover shipping back to him... you came out a bit ahead on the original shipment cost, after all.
Finally, I think that the OP should eat the cost of the Money Order.
Honestly, as the seller, it's your responsibility to know what you have. Failing that, it's only right to make things right when you err.
...and, again, that is all it was... an error. Anyone with a brain should be able to see that. I do not believe, FOR ONE MOMENT, that you WILLINGLY and/or KNOWINGLY misled the OP on this. As has been said, we can't all be expected to be 100% up to speed on GW's release schedule.
Live. Learn. Repeat.
=============================
As a side note:
Shipping.
The shipping cost issue is the EXACT REASON that I factore shipping costs in as part of the sell price and NOT separately.
If I sell you a model for $20 and $5 shipping with D.C., and you get it in a bubble envelops with D.C. and it cost me about $2.50 to ship, you're not going to be happy... I took $2.50 more from you in a way you might see as dishonest.
If I sell it to you for $25.00, shipped... then it's all good. You paid $22.50 for the model & $2.50 for shipping.
The second buyer will be happier almost EVERY TIME.
Eric
With exception of the traders listed above, the comments in this thread make me not want to trade anymore.
Holy cr@p, people. This is Bartertown... We're supposed to come here to trade stuff IN GOOD FAITH with each other. In such a utopian society, "Buyer Beware" is unnecessary, as the SELLER makes sure to note ALL INFO.
It's called being a good seller (no offense, DarkSoul... I'll touch on this again later. PLEASE wait until you read the rest of my post).
Those of you who say it is the buyers RESPONSIBILITY to ask all of the specifics of a model are DEAD WRONG.
It is the SELLERS job to ACCURATELY DESCRIBE the item(s) they are selling.
Now, a trader who has been burned, taken, misled, or made mistakes... or one who is sceptical by nature (all me)... will automatically ask certain questions. That is a good buyer habit... but should, most definitely, NOT be assumed to be his/her responsibility.
To those who say it IS his responsibility, I offer the following scenario. Interpreting your thoughts STRICTLY, the seller would NOT be in the wrong here (keep in mind, I am aware that I am overdoing it... but the fact is that it fits your specifics.
Seller has:
3 (10 man) squads (newest edition) of IG Cadians,cleaned of flash, unassembled & primed black. Primer is NOT globbed or runny. Each squad contains the complete pieces for 1 sgt (c-sword & laspistol), 8 las troops & 1 grenade launcher.
1 GW Bloodthirster in box (newest edition, box contents are complete)
1 Converted Eldar Avatar (assembled cleanly and primed, no thick glue, no flash lines)-- converted to hold 2 swords (no other conversions), Cityfight rubble decorated base.
It just so happens that you are looking for all of these items. You contact the seller (180 rating). He has no camera, but describes the models to you to the extent above. He mentions nothing exceptional about them... he goes into a lot of detail. Nothing seems amiss. Everything seems fine.
You get the models after sending him whatever you bought/traded for them.
You discover that:
The 3 (10 man) squads (newest edition) of IG Cadians ARE unassembled...
... but they USED to be assembled and painted. He took them apart and primed the pieces black. Since they were described as unassembled and primed, you didn't think to ask if they had ever been assembled, or if the primer was sprayed OVER old paint.... and he never said it WASN'T.
...and there are no bases. The descriptions say that he has the pieces for the MODELS. NOT the bases... and he doesn't consider the BASE as part of the model (many gamers, like myself, don't).
To put the icing on the cake, the OLD GLUE REMNANTS were left in place before priming and are still there
The Bloodthirster? Oh. You're gonna LOVE this.
It IS the newest one... and it IS in the box... it's even COMPLETE... Of course, it's poorly painted and scratched up. He yanked off the wings and base (it's present, because the ad said the box set was COMPLETE), and crammed the pieces in the B-Thirster box without padding it or anything.... He never said it was NEW in box.
The Avatar has TWO LEFT HANDS (or right hands... whichever holds the sword). The model is well put together. In fact, except for the hand thing, it would qualify as professionally assembled. It's pinned, GSed, the whole deal. Even the base looks nice.
Is the seller wrong??? Or, should the buyer have made sure to ask if "unassembled" meant that they were once assembled, then ripped apart? Should he have asked if "complete pieces" included the base? Should he have asked if "in box" meant that the thing was assembled, painted poorly, used, ripped apart, then crammed into the old box? Should he have asked if the swords were in the appropriate hand for the arm that hand was attached to?
Stupid buyer. It was his fault.
Come on, people. It is the SELLER'S RESPONSIBILITY to accurately list his items. It is POOR TRADE PRACTICE to leave things off and claim "Buyer Beware" if the guy was honest enough to presume that you would be honest, too.
Those out there screaming "Buyer Beware" make me wonder about THEIR trade practices.
No insult intended, but it's a pretty cr@ppy thing to blame the buyer.
Back to DarkSoul.
First off... I'd still trade with you. I don't think you did anything WRONG, per se. I just think you made a mistake. It's cool. We all do it.
Pobody's Nerfect.
I think that offering to refund his money (except shipping) is the right thing to do... but I think YOU should cover shipping back to him... you came out a bit ahead on the original shipment cost, after all.
Finally, I think that the OP should eat the cost of the Money Order.
Honestly, as the seller, it's your responsibility to know what you have. Failing that, it's only right to make things right when you err.
...and, again, that is all it was... an error. Anyone with a brain should be able to see that. I do not believe, FOR ONE MOMENT, that you WILLINGLY and/or KNOWINGLY misled the OP on this. As has been said, we can't all be expected to be 100% up to speed on GW's release schedule.
Live. Learn. Repeat.
=============================
As a side note:
Shipping.
The shipping cost issue is the EXACT REASON that I factore shipping costs in as part of the sell price and NOT separately.
If I sell you a model for $20 and $5 shipping with D.C., and you get it in a bubble envelops with D.C. and it cost me about $2.50 to ship, you're not going to be happy... I took $2.50 more from you in a way you might see as dishonest.
If I sell it to you for $25.00, shipped... then it's all good. You paid $22.50 for the model & $2.50 for shipping.
The second buyer will be happier almost EVERY TIME.
Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.
Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.
I think what this situation needs is some imagination.
"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell
Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.
Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.
I think what this situation needs is some imagination.
"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell
Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.
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DarkSoul ( 676 )
- Millenium Trader
- Posts: 1082
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2003 5:55 pm
- Location: Cincinnati Ohio
- Contact:
MM, thanks it was a mistake i freely admitted it to him and told apologized for the inconvience... i offed to send him his entire money order back (that included the shipping he paid) all i asked was that he in return ship back my miniatures. at which he replied that wouldn't do he didn't think he should be out the cost of shipping it back and the money order... he then threated to post a negative feedback if i didn't make him happy.Back to DarkSoul.
First off... I'd still trade with you. I don't think you did anything WRONG, per se. I just think you made a mistake. It's cool. We all do it.
Pobody's Nerfect.
I think that offering to refund his money (except shipping) is the right thing to do... but I think YOU should cover shipping back to him... you came out a bit ahead on the original shipment cost, after all.
Finally, I think that the OP should eat the cost of the Money Order.
From: kbolster12345 ( 86 )
To: DarkSoul
Posted: Mon May 21 12:27: GMT 2007
Subject: Re: Hand Gunners
DarkSoul wrote:
I'm sorry, you can send them back and I'll be glad to send your money order back... i haven't cashed it yet!
Honestly I didnt think about them being out of print. the new ones are not called hand gunners.. they are a multi part model that can be hand gunners or crossbow men... I would have listed them as such. either way... I'm sorry for the confusion.
I know that the HG's are a multi but they, as far as I know, they are still called Handgunners. I can't get to GW site right now because of my work's filter but here are a couple of sites I check things out on...
http://battlewagon-bits.com/product/86-09
http://www.chaosorc.com/product_info.ph ... 6603b20b2e
Also you check out those prices and I could have ordered these for brand new for a couple of dollars more which is also lead me to believe they were not OOP.
I could mail them back if I wanted to pay for shipping again. BTW shipping cost you $2 (assuming the padded envelope cost 40 or so cents) and I paid $5 for shipping. I also paid a fee to be able to pay for the MO. And I believe I pay another fee to cancel the MO too.
So I am going to be out money, time, and opportunities to have traded/bought handgunners from other sources because you misrepresented what you are selling. this is not a viable solution and will result in negative feedback.
That is what made me angry... I don't like be threatened.
after which i posted this to him.
From: DarkSoul ( 514 )
To: kbolster12345
Posted: Mon May 21 13:18: GMT 2007
Subject: Re: Hand Gunners
kbolster12345 wrote:
DarkSoul wrote:
I'm sorry, you can send them back and I'll be glad to send your money order back... i haven't cashed it yet!
Honestly I didnt think about them being out of print. the new ones are not called hand gunners.. they are a multi part model that can be hand gunners or crossbow men... I would have listed them as such. either way... I'm sorry for the confusion.
I know that the HG's are a multi but they, as far as I know, they are still called Handgunners. I can't get to GW site right now because of my work's filter but here are a couple of sites I check things out on...
http://battlewagon-bits.com/product/86-09
http://www.chaosorc.com/product_info.ph ... 6603b20b2e
Also you check out those prices and I could have ordered these for brand new for a couple of dollars more which is also lead me to believe they were not OOP.
I could mail them back if I wanted to pay for shipping again. BTW shipping cost you $2 (assuming the padded envelope cost 40 or so cents) and I paid $5 for shipping. I also paid a fee to be able to pay for the MO. And I believe I pay another fee to cancel the MO too.
So I am going to be out money, time, and opportunities to have traded/bought handgunners from other sources because you misrepresented what you are selling. this is not a viable solution and will result in negative feedback.
First off i didn't misrepresent anything... Second don't threaten me... no where in my add did i state they were new hand gunners.. or even lead you to believe they were new hand gunners.. you could have asked, you didn't , i never even thought about it. i have been posting the same hand gunners for months long before the new ones were out...
I offered you your money order back... if thats not good enough then post negative feedback.. i don't care, I'M not paying you for your lost time thats nuts.. by the same token i could say you cost me money and time and trades that i could have gotten from other people for the hand gunners and you waisted my time not asking in the first place.. that sounds just as stupid to me...your trying to bully me into something to get your way and i don't appreciate it... holding my rating hostage is against bartertown rules and you know that...
_________________
Regards,
Thomas Sexton
after this.. he posted all he really wanted was $5.00 back... for someone who felt so slighted... it all boiled down to $5.00... if he would have just said that in the first place with out all the accusations.. i would have just refunded him the F'n 5.00 and it would have been over and done.. but no he had to go post it out here... and try to run my name through the mudd... I don't get it.. Ive been here 7 almost 8 years now I have a outstanding reputation and someone is going to treat me like this over $5.00. I can understand someone getting pissed that they think they were wronged.. but don't go slinging things at someone for no reason. Whats next pain and suffering for the excitement of thinking you were getting one thing and then not getting exactly what you thought...
Does anyone actually think i tried to rip him off... if you do then you have never dealt with me or dealt with anyone that knows me... just look at my feedback I'm one of the most generous traders on this board and i don't deserve to be treated like that over $5.00 and a mistake on both parties fault.
Regards,
Thomas Sexton
-- My Soul was removed to make room for all this Sarcasm.
Thomas Sexton
-- My Soul was removed to make room for all this Sarcasm.
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beowulfdahunter ( 196 )
- Expert Trader
- Posts: 864
- Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2003 6:01 am
- Location: IL USA
Darksoul, thanks for posting your side of this trade. I think this guy is being a drama queen. And as a Drama queen myself it takes one to know one.
Looking over things, I feel you where honest and up front, any mistake was on his end. I have done numerous deals with you in the past and have always had no problems.
As far as these people who are all shocked and agast that one might suggest a buyer protect themselves from being shafted....what planet do you people live on?
I say keep the money and tell him to sod off, if he leaves you negative feed back, let me know I will PP you a few bucks.
Looking over things, I feel you where honest and up front, any mistake was on his end. I have done numerous deals with you in the past and have always had no problems.
As far as these people who are all shocked and agast that one might suggest a buyer protect themselves from being shafted....what planet do you people live on?
I say keep the money and tell him to sod off, if he leaves you negative feed back, let me know I will PP you a few bucks.
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kbolster12345 ( 350 )
- Expert Trader
- Posts: 520
- Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2003 4:38 pm
Dude I was honetly looking for other people's opinions. I was not mudrucking anyone. sorry your the only one with 500 + feedback it never occured to me that you would be the only one.and try to run my name through the mudd...
Your the one that put your name on it.
It's funny because you mentioned buying a car. Well I just did buy a brand new Mini Van and it's one of 2 brand Consumer Reports rated the highest. Needless to say after a week it's in the shop and it's been there for 2 weeks.Darksoul, thanks for posting your side of this trade. I think this guy is being a drama queen. And as a Drama queen myself it takes one to know one.
I am still not convinced this wasnt' misleading but there is a definet divide and this must be in the grey area. Keep in mind he did know they are OOP.
I did ask for $5. I thought it should have been $10 off what I paid for oop stuff but asked for $5 because it's splitting the difference. I felt it is a much more fair price. And like DarkSoul I have been here for about 7 years to and have a pretty good idea of the value of things.
If I don't get what I think I am getting you will be sending me money for me to ship it back to you. So be very certain I know what I am getting.
Also more of what I don't want doesn't make up for not getting what I agreed upon.
Either will result in negative feedback, posting of our records in the appropriate section of bartertown, and possible mailfruad. Otherwise don't trade with me.
Also more of what I don't want doesn't make up for not getting what I agreed upon.
Either will result in negative feedback, posting of our records in the appropriate section of bartertown, and possible mailfruad. Otherwise don't trade with me.
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starslayer ( 560 )
- Millenium Trader
- Posts: 2410
- Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 4:27 pm
- Location: Pennsylvania,USA
Darksoul and Kbolster, you guys both need to take a step back, take a deep breath and relax. Both you guys are really getting angry over this. I think it was an honest mistake on both your parts. I dont think Darksoul was trying to mislead you. There are those out there that would gladly pay that price for OOP handgunners.
I think you guys should just split the difference. Darksoul should keep the $2 used to ship the figs and refund the rest as a money order. Darksoul should have put they were OOP, but I'm sure that was an oversight. Kbolster should have asked if they were new or old figs,but he overlooked that. You both made mistakes,no big deal, just cut your losses and finish this up. Kbolster, you'll be out $3, big deal. Darksoul will be out $3,big deal. You are both good guys,I've dealt with you in the past. Is all this worth $3.
I had almost the same situation happen to me. I was looking for the really old OOP Dwarf Handgunners. I explained I was not looking for the recently OOP metal or recently OOP plastics Dwarfs. These guys had to be 10+ years OOP. A trader contacted me with 10 OOP old metal handgunners. I again asked if they were the very old OOP ones,he assured me they were. I got them,they werent.
I contacted the trader,he had a very good attitude, and said he had made an honest mistake. I asked him for a refund, he gave it, I shipped the figs back. We both "ate" the shipping charges. Afterwards we gave positive refs. It all came back to attitude and response. He was freindly and apologetic, I was not accusatory towards him either. So I was out $4 + $1 for a money order. $5 isnt that big of a deal, it doesnt happen that often to get upset about. That was the only time that has happened to me.
I short, you guys should just apologize,cut your insignificant loss, and bury this.
I think you guys should just split the difference. Darksoul should keep the $2 used to ship the figs and refund the rest as a money order. Darksoul should have put they were OOP, but I'm sure that was an oversight. Kbolster should have asked if they were new or old figs,but he overlooked that. You both made mistakes,no big deal, just cut your losses and finish this up. Kbolster, you'll be out $3, big deal. Darksoul will be out $3,big deal. You are both good guys,I've dealt with you in the past. Is all this worth $3.
I had almost the same situation happen to me. I was looking for the really old OOP Dwarf Handgunners. I explained I was not looking for the recently OOP metal or recently OOP plastics Dwarfs. These guys had to be 10+ years OOP. A trader contacted me with 10 OOP old metal handgunners. I again asked if they were the very old OOP ones,he assured me they were. I got them,they werent.
I contacted the trader,he had a very good attitude, and said he had made an honest mistake. I asked him for a refund, he gave it, I shipped the figs back. We both "ate" the shipping charges. Afterwards we gave positive refs. It all came back to attitude and response. He was freindly and apologetic, I was not accusatory towards him either. So I was out $4 + $1 for a money order. $5 isnt that big of a deal, it doesnt happen that often to get upset about. That was the only time that has happened to me.
I short, you guys should just apologize,cut your insignificant loss, and bury this.
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ancientsociety ( 842 )
- Millenium Trader
- Posts: 1654
- Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 2:46 pm
- Location: Chicago, IL
@Darksoul: kbolster wasn't trying to "run your name thru the mud" because he never mentioned you by name, until you decided to post here. Until that time, I'm sure most of us didn't know who it was (yes, I'm sure some people assumed it may be you). If he was, then you'd have some form of neg ref and/or BTR. You have neither of those. kbolster was simply asking for input.
Anyway, since you're the more established trader, take the high road and pay for the return shipping. You came out ahead on the shipping to you and you made a mistake about not fully disclosing the handgunner's edition. Just be done with it and learn from it.
@Beowulf: You likened this situation to buying a car - ever heard of something called a Lemon Law?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_law
@Magickal: I'm in agreement. Regarding shipping costs, when I sell something, I'll ask for the other trader's zip and I'll calculate it roughly at USPS.com. I'm fairly good with guesstimating weight so I'm usually very close or spot on. If I qoute too low, I'll pay the difference personally for shipping and if it's valued over $50, I'll also pay for insurance out of pocket. I'm not trying to shaft anyone out of money on shipping (I think I've been, at most, off maybe $2) but I don't own a scale and I can't stop off at my local PO every other day to use their's.
Anyway, since you're the more established trader, take the high road and pay for the return shipping. You came out ahead on the shipping to you and you made a mistake about not fully disclosing the handgunner's edition. Just be done with it and learn from it.
@Beowulf: You likened this situation to buying a car - ever heard of something called a Lemon Law?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_law
@Magickal: I'm in agreement. Regarding shipping costs, when I sell something, I'll ask for the other trader's zip and I'll calculate it roughly at USPS.com. I'm fairly good with guesstimating weight so I'm usually very close or spot on. If I qoute too low, I'll pay the difference personally for shipping and if it's valued over $50, I'll also pay for insurance out of pocket. I'm not trying to shaft anyone out of money on shipping (I think I've been, at most, off maybe $2) but I don't own a scale and I can't stop off at my local PO every other day to use their's.
Trading Guidelines:
1. Lower rating ships first - even if I am purchasing.
2. If you agree to buy something, you have 72hrs. in which to pay. If payment is not received in 72hrs., I will automatically post a Non-Payment/Backout thread.
3. Refs are left upon positive receipt of goods, NEVER beforehand!
4. I accept Paypal & USPS money orders and charge for shipping AT COST. I make no profit from it.
5. I trade NIB/new models at retail.
1. Lower rating ships first - even if I am purchasing.
2. If you agree to buy something, you have 72hrs. in which to pay. If payment is not received in 72hrs., I will automatically post a Non-Payment/Backout thread.
3. Refs are left upon positive receipt of goods, NEVER beforehand!
4. I accept Paypal & USPS money orders and charge for shipping AT COST. I make no profit from it.
5. I trade NIB/new models at retail.
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kbolster12345 ( 350 )
- Expert Trader
- Posts: 520
- Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2003 4:38 pm
You are right. It's only a little bit about the amount of money it's really the principal but this is certainly becoming a mountain out of a mole hill.Darksoul and Kbolster, you guys both need to take a step back, take a deep breath and relax. Both you guys are really getting angry over this.
It is somewhat interesting to hear the two different views. Prior to this I was not aware that there was a divide like this. Certainly I was fortunate to have traded this long to not have a problem like this. To me that is pertinent information that I would include upfront.
At this point this is a good idea. I don't want this to degrade any further. At this point I am willing to suck up the full cost and let it lie. Really it's not that big of a deal. I can still use the models it's just not what I expected. Not only did I want the models but the new bitz left over for conversion and such. At this point I a willing to walk away and consider the "extra" money I spent a relatively cheap learning experience.I short, you guys should just apologize,cut your insignificant loss, and bury this.
@ DarkSoul: I was upset because I felt you didn't make an effort to disclose information that I feel is information that should have been included in your original post. To me it seems that someone with your trade experience should have known that and probably expect it from others. I can, however, see that it may have been an oversight. As stated before it's certainly in a grey area. Some people, I am not saying you, could try to take advantage of that grey area. Not an original reason for this post but maybe an unseen benefit of this dialogue.
I am officially apologizing for making you feel like I was running your name throught the mud. That certainly was not my intent in this post. I was looking for feedback to help me solve a situation that was new to me. My, I believe second PM, was hasty to mention neg feedback and I didn't allow enough time for us to work out a viable solution.
In the future please make an effort to tell someone if it's not current edition. I budgeted my money and resources carefully according to recieving current handgunners and the bitz. Certainly you can understand the dissapointment and budget issues.
If I don't get what I think I am getting you will be sending me money for me to ship it back to you. So be very certain I know what I am getting.
Also more of what I don't want doesn't make up for not getting what I agreed upon.
Either will result in negative feedback, posting of our records in the appropriate section of bartertown, and possible mailfruad. Otherwise don't trade with me.
Also more of what I don't want doesn't make up for not getting what I agreed upon.
Either will result in negative feedback, posting of our records in the appropriate section of bartertown, and possible mailfruad. Otherwise don't trade with me.