So.. how do you beat tau again?

[Doctari]

Dear Orky,

My boyz are getting steam rolled again and again against this horrific wall of 18" range 3 shot str 5 death. And that's after they have weathered a billion shots ignoring cover (good by bikers, we barely knew you, and you too KFF).

I thought dakka jets might be the answer but as of now that doesn't seem to be the case.

Thoughts or opinions?

Frustrated in Waaaaagh.

[MagickalMemories]

My group has beeen in "build mode" for the tables in our campaign for a couple months, now. Not actual TABLES... terrain. LOL So, I have zero experience yet.
Unfortunately, I really just don't see a way for you to beat Tau, except for happenstance. The new Tau codex is stupidly overpowered. I just don't know WTF GW was thinking of.

If you're going to have ANY chance -and it's not much of one- it will be with shooty orks.

I don't know how many points you play, so I can't be too specific.

KFF Meks
Multiple full squads of Lootas (10 or more)
If your group allows FW, and you have them available, put the Lootas in Big Squigoths
Large groups of Boyz with shootas. Take advantage of terrain and KFF saves.
Anything with range and shots, basically. Heavy Weapon support.
Maybe an Aegis Defense line with a Quad gun? Put the grot H. Weapon squads in here for better BS shots.
If you're playing enough points, make it 2 Force Org charts. Take 2 Aegis Defense lines and spam Lootas.
The idea here is that (a) you take advantage of cover saves and (b) you don't have GOOD shooting, but you have A LOT of it.

Like I said... you don't have much of a chance, but going with shooting is about the best you have.


Eric

[Doctari]

Well at least I'm not the only one who thinks it's a wee tad overpowered.

I've not tried the looters so I think I'll give them a whirl. I will say this much though with pathfinders and the ridiculousness that is the broken spotter lights KFF might as well not exist. Whichever unit he wants to disappear simply ignores the forcefields cover save and then pumps a billion (ok maybe I'm being hyperbolic but 8 broadsides with missle load out might as well be a billion) rockets hitting on a 2+ TL into them and they evaporate.

Thanks for the feedback Eric!

[optimusprime14]

Battle wagons

If he's taking misslesides then the best he can do is glance it. Take 3+ 12" (13" with RPJ) and turbo boost the first 2 turns. Hide a unit of nob bikers with a painboy and cybork bodies behind them Covers saves don't matter when you have a 2+ save and a 5+ FNP.

It's a tough match up because they will outshoot you but you need to get to them as fast as you can.

Do you play on a table with LoS terrain or alot of ruins/area terrain? You need LoS blocking terrain. Make his pathfinders move, then they can only snapfire their markerlights

Another tip, the best thing that beats Tau is....Tau! Take some Tau allies (I believe they are battle brothers)

[reegsk]

What does his list generally look like? I suppose what I would recommend is swamp his targeting arrays with as many fast units as you can - trukk boys, kommandos, stormboys and bikers. No nobs, special weapons or vehicle upgrades. You're going for the maximum number of units and models you can field on the table. Infiltrate the kommandos. Those will surely take priority and almost definitely die in turn one, but that gives your other units the opportunity to move up. Your trukks can cover almost the entire ground from your deployment zone to his in a single turn. I would recommend keeping them just outside of 15" to avoid getting double-tapped by his gunline. Obviously, pulse rifles will ANNIHILATE trukks, but they're not supposed to survive. They're simply there to force him into wasting the firepower of one of his units to destroy a 30 point transport. And the likelihood of your unit suffering damage is diminished by the Ramshackle rule. So, say he has six full units of Firewarriors (which I, personally, would run every time). A single unit of Firewarriors shooting at a trukk over 15" away will likely destroy it (12 shots = 6 hits = 3 glances/pens, which eliminates all of its hull points). Now he's down to five firewarrior squads. The next squad shoots the boys, and let's say he throws in the Ethereal's extra shot ability with some markerlights from the pathfinders to negate cover. Unit dead. The upside here? Two units of firewarriors have fired, leaving four, and both the Ethereal and Pathfinders have expended their abilities. You have five units in trukks still alive, to say nothing of any other fast units you have on the table. The next FW squad blows up the next trukk, and the boys fall out. However, the fourth FW squad won't be able to kill them. They don't have enough shots and likely won't have the support the previous unit-killing squad did (unless he doubles up on Ethereals and Pathfinders). So it'll take at least one, possibly two more units, meaning he'll have, at best, one squad left to fire with. You still have four mounted squads of boys. About 16" away. Which means drive 6" next turn, disembark 6", call your Waaagh! and make sure you roll at least a 4" assault.

Obviously, he'll have a lot more firepower with Broadsides and Hammerheads, hence why I asked about his general list. But my point is that, if you saturate the field with all low-priority, low-cost targets, you won't feel their loss as much AND you'll guarantee that something will get to his line.

The next hurdle is Overwatch, which with their combined fire nonsense can be a real bastard. Here's how to get around it - take your most chewed-up, smallest or worthless unit and assault multiple units. Spread 'em out when they disembark and assault as many units as you can. Remember that his units have to be within 6" of each other to Overwatch the same target, so this should be an easy task. Even if that unit gets completely destroyed or fails its charge, your opponent just used up his Overwatch, so you're good. This also ties all of the assaults together, so after you're done manhandling (or orkhandling) his firewarriors, there's a slim chance that one of his units won't break, keeping your boys tied up in combat and non-viable targets in your opponent's next shooting phase.

[TheOgreTyrant]

When using orks, the answer is simple.....
WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously though as a fellow ork player,the above suggestions are really good and I would suggest going with them. I still slightly struggle with the tau, but I can hold my own with the orks still. Idk, maybe the guys I am playing against dont run as OP lists as the guys you play. Either way, tons of good suggestions above

[kturock]

screening units.

[Gaijin18]

use IG tactics,,,,,choke those fancy techno machines with the bodies of boys,,,lots of boys

[MagickalMemories]

Here's how to get around it - take your most chewed-up, smallest or worthless unit and assault multiple units. Spread 'em out when they disembark and assault as many units as you can. Remember that his units have to be within 6" of each other to Overwatch the same target, so this should be an easy task. Even if that unit gets completely destroyed or fails its charge, your opponent just used up his Overwatch, so you're good.

This is the only point I disagree on.
Any 40K player worth a sh** is NOT going to declare that he is shooting with all of the assaulted units. He's going to look at which unit(s) won't likely be charged with a second Boyz unit & declare fire with them. He will piecemeal you to death by shooting one or two units at your assaulting troops.

If your boys declare an assault on 3 units and only one unit chooses to fire overwatch & destroys those boyz, the other 2 units can still fire, should you choose to assault them with a different unit (which is the idea behind this tactic).

Some players will shoot everything, but most GOOD players will figure the odds and only shoot with what they think they need.


Eric

[reegsk]

The likelihood of them destroying a unit is extremely low, though. A single unit of Firewarriors is only going to score about three wounds, so as long as you're close enough, you'll still make contact. And that is assuming that the Firewarriors haven't taken any wounds themselves.

[ulpitt]

As a Tau player, I still have trouble with lots of Orks. There are two Ork players in my area.
One runs a speed freak list at 1750 with
3 mobz of trukk boyz
3 mobz in Battle wagons
something like 9 bikes
Wazzdakka
Ghazghkull

The other guy plays Green Tide
He just takes as many boyz as he can fit in a list. Also, Cybork Bodies with Grotsnik go a lot further than you think.

Just 2 cents from a Shas'O that still has trouble with you silly fungal people.

[MagickalMemories]

I am surprised that these lists give you issues.
The Speed Freeks seems like a no-brainer.
Turn 1, focus on bikes, then BWagons (larger groups of Boys). Move onto Trukks, as necessary.
Turn 2, focus on trukks and closest units of Boys.
Any boys that get within charge range SHOULD be decimated by your extra ability to add on fire to charging units if your unit's within 6".

As for the "Green Tide" list... Well, I'm presuming you mean that he has a lot of large units of boys & not that he plays the Apoc formation in a regular game. LOL
In that case, just focus on each unit of boys, one at a time, until it's down to 8 or less models & watch the Ld rolls with a smile.

Cybork is only a 5+ save. If he's taking it on EVERYTHING, he's taking a huge hit on the # of boys he's taking fr a save that's only going to save 1 in 3 boys. Otherwise, just HAMMER the units he DID make cybork.

Eric
(Who took an all cybork GROT army once, just for the Hell of it).

[optimusprime14]

That and most of your weapons are AP5 and you can ignore cover with markerlights and SMS so you would, and he dies, no save

[ulpitt]

Well,
That all makes sense. Looks like I'm going to chalk this one up to I'm still learning the game and (even more) my codex, or terrain, or I'm an idiot.
All of those sound viable.

[reegsk]

It's that and the fact that Tau play very differently from most other armies. Imperial Guard can flood the field with bodies, but those bodies kind of suck. Even the occasional heavy weapon has BS3, and thus a 50/50 at hitting. Usually you can target their vehicles and heavy weapons squads, and then just mop up. Space Marines and MEQs, by far the most common, you heavily outnumber. You'll take losses, but you'll definitely get into close combat where you excel. Tau can flood the field with lots of bodies, and those bodies are WAY more effective than IG, and actually have better weapons than Space Marines. It's a very different army, and they just got a HUGE shot in the arm.