Farewell and Adieu

[Grudgebearer]

To make a long story short I have been asked to leave bartertown for not individually listing the items for sale in two adds I had posted. Here is the sequence of events as it unfolded:

Grudgebearer wrote:
I'm selling some limited editions, oop minis, boxed sets and other misc. 40K and WHFB minis. Feel free to make a FAIR offer but keep in mind lowballers will be ignored. NO Trades. Paypal only. Buyer agrees to pay all shipping, handling, and optional insurance fees.

Pics of everything can be seen here: http://s1130.photobucket.com/albums/m535/tonyp69/

Hey.. barter town rules require you to list what you are selling on this site, not just linking to offsite photo sites.

Please take a minute to update your post.

-Porkuslime

I did list what I am selling " I'm selling some limited editions, oop minis, boxed sets and other misc. 40K and WHFB minis. "

Yes, but we need it like this..

30 plastic horses with heads
Teclis in blister,

plastic necromancer from wizard box

That sort of thing.

As part of a trade ad, a good comprehensive listing of what you are offering helps. Also, even though this may sound daft, having the list here, lets people find what they are looking for in search results too.

With all due respect I do not have the time nor the inclination to individually list everything. I stated clearly and honestly what I had for sale and even took the time to provide pictures of the items. If this website is going to harass and nitpick over such trivial things then it's time to quit using the site. Amazingly enough the admins of other websites have not complained once about ads like this posted by myself and others. I've also noticed ads on bartertown that have photo links just like mine that have been up for weeks. Could you also please send me the e-mail address of the person who owns the Bartertown website? I would like to make them aware of these facts as well and let them know that I, as a site user, do not appreciate the harassment over such a minor and trivial issue.

Certainly.

The Head Admin is Linrandir and is found at linrandir@bartertown.com

My other co-Admin is Magickalmemories, and I have included both Linrandir and Magickamemories on this PM.

The Bartertown Rules document is found here:
viewtopic.php?f=44&t=45470

please take a moment to review it. Specifically, the issue we are dealing with right now is Rule 4 and 4a.

-Porkuslime

Then, perhaps you're correct. Perhaps it is time for you to quit using Bartertown if you don't think you need to follow our posted rules because you happen to find them trivial and don't seem to know/understand the reasons they are the way they are.

Other sites might not have a problem with it, but I'd challenge you to find a site with the kind of history Bartertown has in regards to trading gaming supplies. Our experience dictates our decisions.

I've noted that, to date, you've not done as asked and listed the specific items you have available. Please, let us know if you intend to do so. That way, we know whether or not we need to remove those ads.

For posterity, I'd like to inform you that the site owner is TrademasterAdam. You can also PM him with your grudges, but it's only fair to inform you that he'll simply refer you to Linrandir. So, to make things less bothersome to yourself, you'd be better off emailing or PMing him directly.

Eric

P.S. As volunteer staff, we police our members' ads as best we can. Please, feel free to report any ads you see that only list links, as yours do, and we'll handle them accordingly. You can report them by PMing any of us a link to the ad, or by hitting the "report" button.

I have no intention of changing the adds. If this is what you must do to inflate your sense of self worth then by all means do so. Also, feel free to, and I quote, " police our members' ads as best we can. " I can almost hear Eric Cartman saying " RESPECT MA AUTHORITAH!" I was under the impression this was a friendly site where people traded gaming supplies and not some sort of police state. So, I leave you and the the rest of the brown shirts to "police" your regime. I will be happily cruising other sites where the admins aren't currently trying to squeeze lumps of coal into diamonds using only the power of their rectums.

[kturock]

If your too important to bother to list you models. I don't want to bother you by looking at them and making an offer. I would probably offend you when I don't offer my weight in gold for each item.

Seriously, even ebay, who's only in it for the money, wants you to describe things you list.
Bartertown is free and makes no money on it and askes for a full description for items. What you might consider well painted or complete, others would consider average and missing parts.

Most of us won't even read an ad without descriptions.
You don't have the time to list tehm, I don't have the time to read them.

My high horse is just as high as yours. Don't fall off it. You're hurting no one but youself by not listing here, since we don't care. You either sell or trade or don't.
Nothing that any of us can't live without.

[don_mondo]

So someone with a 0 rating (ie never completed a trade here) is too important to list their items? Good riddance.

[jason1977]

So someone with a 0 rating (ie never completed a trade here) is too important to list their items? Good riddance.

0 trades and a member for 6 years. Im just over one year old here and I have 30. take care.

[Imaginos]

I'm with others here. I'm not sure how you would be a member here since 2006, actually using the services, and end up with a 0 rating. Respect the others in the community. Don't expect them to bend to what you want. Follow the rules. If you don't want to follow the rules of the community, it is better off without you. (We do the same thing in society, you know.)

[MattHoell]

Way to make yourself look like an *ss.

I have had my problems with the BT admins locking my ads and what not, sure it's annoying but hey those are the rules and this is a free site. There's a mature and grown up way to handle these things. And your post isn't it.

I would definitely take your own advice and move on, I don't think BT is for you.

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

Hey mate,

In future, when making this sort of complaint, it would be helpful to us your readers if you were to divide up the comments and attribute them--it makes it much easier for us to follow the thread of the conversation. You'll observe the "Quote" button towards the top of the text box--it's very handy.

I also note that nowhere does any admin ask you to leave the site. You, in fact, are the one that suggests that you should leave, and I see Eric agreeing that it might be time for you to leave, but I don't see any punitive suggestions.

So someone with a 0 rating (ie never completed a trade here) is too important to list their items? Good riddance.

He's completed some trades....

Looking at your 6 trades here, Grudgebearer, I see that you have 5 good ones and one bad one in your feedback. Not a lot of moral high ground on which to push back against the staff when you're told to obey the rules.

[don_mondo]

So someone with a 0 rating (ie never completed a trade here) is too important to list their items? Good riddance.

Looking at your 6 trades here, I see that you have 5 good ones and one bad one in your feedback. Not a lot of moral high ground on which to push back against the staff when you're told to obey the rules.

Not sure who you looked at but it certainly wasn't me. Current rating 474...........................

Oh wait, never mind, I got it. HIS rating of zero comprised of 5 ggod and one bad.

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

Not sure who you looked at but it certainly wasn't me. Current rating 474...........................

Oh wait, never mind, I got it. HIS rating of zero comprised of 5 ggod and one bad.

Fixed it for clarity.

[Forsaken Poptart]

Not only is it a violation of the rules, it's downright dumb- as a consumer, I'm not going to take the time to go through a list of models I want and hope it matches with the models you may or may not have on hand. You're going to need to make a list eventually anyway, so why not just do it when you make your posting. There's a reason that boxes have labels- imagine if your LGS only kept the shelves full of white boxes that said "MODELS" on them, and you had to go through every single box to find what you want. Sounds awful, just like your posts.

On a further note, if you don't have time to type out a simple list of what you have, when are you ever going to find time to get to the post office to complete my end of the trade? Apparently you're super busy, which is fine, but I don't want to wait weeks for you to free up a few minutes to ship.

[MagickalMemories]

I went through and added generic "quote" boxes around each message. It's far easier to read that way.
Oh, and it's only fair to note that, IF he comes back, it won't be for a month. I've suspended him for the "power of their rectums" (and related) commentary sent to me via PM. Mind you, that was before I was aware this humorous ragequit was even here.
Silly, silly man.

Eric

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

I've suspended him for the "power of their rectums" (and related) commentary sent to me via PM.

You should add those comments to the thread....

[Forsaken Poptart]

I've suspended him for the "power of their rectums" (and related) commentary sent to me via PM.

You should add those comments to the thread....

That's the bottom message. Fantasic!

[MagickalMemories]

It's there... the whole last quoted post is his PM response to me.
As for what I said in the notice that will pop up when/if he tries to log in... I've got no reason to post that. If he ever returns, however, it won't bother me if HE posts it.

Eric

[Ironhide]

Normally I would reserve this kind of conversation for the mod forums, but since it is out here in the open I'll play the Devil's Advocate here. Note what follows is my personal opinions on the subject and my interpretation of the rules as listed.

First let's look at the ad...

H: Misc WHFB & 40K W: $ Paypal

Unread postby Grudgebearer » Sun Aug 19, 2012 5:59 pm
I'm selling some limited editions, oop minis, boxed sets and other misc. 40K and WHFB minis. Feel free to make a FAIR offer but keep in mind lowballers will be ignored. NO Trades. Paypal only. Buyer agrees to pay all shipping, handling, and optional insurance fees.

Pics of everything can be seen here: http://s1130.photobucket.com/albums/m535/tonyp69/

Now let's look at the rules referenced....

Rule #4: Ad format: Use a proper DESCRIPTIVE Title & Content
If you want to post your ad in multiple relevant forums, which is good, then please title your ad appropriately.

Good example: "Have Eldar and Tau, want to trade for Dark Elves and Empire." This will fit NICELY in the 40K and Fantasy sections!

Bad example: "Have Eldar and Tau." If this shows up in the fantasy section, it will be nuked!
Other BAD examples: "Have stuff.", "H: Lots! W: Lots!"

The rule references titling your ad. Looking at his ad it doesn't seem there is a problem.

The second part of the rule...

Rule 4a: You are also responsible for accurately describing all items that you are trading or selling.
That includes version, condition, assembly status, converted or not, painted or not, any missing pieces and any other information you think might be helpful. Failure to do so may result in the other party filing a Backout Trader or Bad Trader report against you.

Rule 4a ask that you be descriptive in your ad. Is not a picture a description? Have we not allowed pictures in the past to be a form of description? If memory serves, we have.

I personally don't see how he broke either rule listed above, and do not understand why his ad was taken down. Now, would his ad have gotten a lot of responses from potential buyers? Maybe, maybe not. That remains to be seen. Could it have been better? Sure. Is it a mod or admins right to take an ad down because it doesn't conform to what they think is the "correct" ad format, even though it falls within the rules? I don't think so.

So someone with a 0 rating (ie never completed a trade here) is too important to list their items? Good riddance.

Not directed solely at you don_mondo, your's was the first post I saw. Maybe if you guys had clicked on his reference number you would have seen he has 6 trades. One of which was a bad trade because of poor communication and some missing shields. He had 2 good trades after that one.

As to his suspension from the site...

I have no intention of changing the adds. If this is what you must do to inflate your sense of self worth then by all means do so. Also, feel free to, and I quote, " police our members' ads as best we can. " I can almost hear Eric Cartman saying " RESPECT MA AUTHORITAH!" I was under the impression this was a friendly site where people traded gaming supplies and not some sort of police state. So, I leave you and the the rest of the brown shirts to "police" your regime. I will be happily cruising other sites where the admins aren't currently trying to squeeze lumps of coal into diamonds using only the power of their rectums.

I do not understand why that resulted in a suspension. He did not name call or seem belligerent to me. He did seem a little self-righteous, but in context to what he was responding to I think it can be somewhat understandable. After all, in his view the people involved were trying to micro-manage his ad and tell him how it should be written. That would kind of piss me off to, I'm surprised it wasn't worse. I think a little anger is understandable.

Again, this is MY personal opinion.