What's with all the personal check hatred??

[MEDEVL]

It seems like a near impossibility to get anyone to take a personal check anymore and I just don't get it. I understand paypal might be more secure but you have to pay fees to use it (or lie), the same to buy a money order. Personal checks are FREE and if you have a bank account free to cash as well. Plus they are by far the easiest things to replace if they get lost in the mail. I guess part of it is a societal shift away from checks as more people do all of their banking online so maybe people today just aren't used to using them but in my mind they are the far superior choice of payment for deals as for the aforementioned reasons.

Does anybody else have trouble getting people to take them or refuse to accept them from other people. Not to toot my own horn but I would think my rating would show I'm not going to stiff you for 20 bucks!!!

[kturock]

I don't take them, probably for the same reason as everyone else.
Banks hold them for 3,5,10 days; even though they can get clearance in minutes or hours.
Also, there are also the fees if they check bounces and then any fees incurred because of that.

If you have a bank, you can get a free or cheap money orders.

[connivingsumo]

It seems like a near impossibility to get anyone to take a personal check anymore and I just don't get it. I understand paypal might be more secure but you have to pay fees to use it (or lie), the same to buy a money order. Personal checks are FREE and if you have a bank account free to cash as well. Plus they are by far the easiest things to replace if they get lost in the mail. I guess part of it is a societal shift away from checks as more people do all of their banking online so maybe people today just aren't used to using them but in my mind they are the far superior choice of payment for deals as for the aforementioned reasons.

Does anybody else have trouble getting people to take them or refuse to accept them from other people. Not to toot my own horn but I would think my rating would show I'm not going to stiff you for 20 bucks!!!

MEDEVL: I'm with you on that, truly. My process with checks is that I'll 'hold it' until it clears; usually the check sender is totally cool with this. Once the check clears, the minis are off in the mail!! That said, however, kturock has a point. If the check DOES NOT clear, then I have to pay a fee for THEIR bouncedass check!! and that really pisses me off!!! So, if I get a good vibe from the person wanting to buy - I'll take their check if they're cool w/me wanting to let it clear first, which - as kturock said - could take 1-10 days. If I get a bad vibe from the buyer, or they're NOT willing to let it clear, then I say PAYPAL only - sorry bud! YMMV (your mileage may vary) but this is my standard.

Cheers bro!

[Imaginos]

I don't take them. If your check bounces, then I have to deal with not only your money issues, but also the bank fee my bank charges for depositing a bounces check.



Edit: eep! Thanks for spelling corrections.

[connivingsumo]

I don't take them. If your check bounces, then I have to deal with not only your money issues, but also he bank fee my bank charges for depositing a ounces check.

Hehe... just helping to translate here...

"I don't take them. If your check bounces, then I have to deal with not only your money issues, but also THE bank fee my bank charges for depositing a BOUNCED check."

[MEDEVL]

You mean to tell me that if you deposit a check from somebody else and they don't have the funds to cover it YOU get charged by YOUR bank??? For what?? You didn't so anything wrong. Is this only if you overdraft because the funds from the bad check that you thought was good are not there or do you just get charge no matter what?? I have never heard of such a thing and if my bank ever tried to do that to me there would be hell to pay.
I can get 1 free money order per month at my bank but I have to go to the bank rather than just writing a check in my kitchen so it's a pain in the butt. I don't mind waiting for checks to clear but most people just won't give you that option any more.

[connivingsumo]

You mean to tell me that if you deposit a check from somebody else and they don't have the funds to cover it YOU get charged by YOUR bank??? For what?? You didn't so anything wrong. Is this only if you overdraft because the funds from the bad check that you thought was good are not there or do you just get charge no matter what?? I have never heard of such a thing and if my bank ever tried to do that to me there would be hell to pay.
I can get 1 free money order per month at my bank but I have to go to the bank rather than just writing a check in my kitchen so it's a pain in the butt. I don't mind waiting for checks to clear but most people just won't give you that option any more.

Yes, MEDEVL, I'm afraid so. I've been a member of two different credit unions (which are usually WAY cooler) and several banks that charge ME a fee if your check bounces. This has nothing to do with overdrafts, or anything like that; in fact, there have been occasions where I've had over 1k sitting in my account and they STILL charge me a $25 fee because someone's check bounces. Now, in the past, I have contested this and they've reversed it, but it's still WRONG and a pain in the a$$!!! So that's why folks aren't real big on checks, but - like I said - if the person is giving me good vibes... I'm all about taking their check (and the risk) and letting it "clear" first, then sending them the goods. That's just me though - many others here on Btown won't take that risk, and I honestly can't blame them.

[Shane]

I've always taken checks. As long as the check writer doesn't mind waiting till it clears

[Adunaphel]

Unfortunately, I have had to take a hit on another's bounced check in the past also. I argued until I was blue in the face, but I was told that the moment you sign the back of the check, you have become partly liable for any shortfall in funds. It's sad. I changed banks, but I suspect that most all of the banks will charge you fees if checks that you were given bounced.

I would be willing to take checks (with certain traders who have a good bit of references), but because of ALL of the hassles involved with checks, I would be hesitant. I REALLY dislike paypal, but I REALLY dislike ALL banks. It's kind of a no win situation.

By the way, my bank charges WAY more than the local grocery store for money orders. And they stopped offering the first one a month free about a year ago. Time's must be tough for banks...

Karl

[kturock]

usps has money orders, but banks don't like them because it's not part of 'the banking community'.
it's good as cash at any post office and if it gets lost or destroyed/damaged, usps replaces it, for free.

[Shane]

also, Canada won't cash usps money orders. Or at least they wouldn't in the past

[kturock]

they won't cash ones in US funds. if the buyer sent the wrong ones, it's like spending foreign money.
you can buy the canadian ones at usps, but it costs a bit more than the domestic one. that's probably what happened, the buyer got cheap and sent you the wrong one. the correct ones have been available for decades.
you can buy usps money orders for canada, japan and mexico. Those can be purchased instantly, mailed and then cashed instantly at any post office in those respective countries.
you can also buy money orders for most every other country, but they take longer. you actually purchase a draft, that is then sent to the money order division of usps. there they convert it to the other counries funds and mailed there. then the recevier can cash it at their bank or post office for their funds.

here's the link explaining about them.

https://www.usps.com/shop/money-orders.htm

and a quick summary.

Money Order Features

Postal Money Orders are…
•Always valid—they never expire.
•Available in values up to $1,000 each if sending within the United States and $700 each if sending abroad.
•Cashable in 29 countries. Which countries? [there's a link on the site]
•Can also be cashed or negotiated at your bank and other financial institutions.
•May be replaceable if damaged, lost, or stolen. Just hold on to your purchase receipt.

What do money orders cost?

$0.01 to $500.00 .......................$1.15
$500.01 to $1,000.00 ................$1.55
Postal Military Money Orders…..$0.30 (issued by military facilities)
International Money Orders…… $4.45

What do you need to buy one?

Cash, debit card, or traveler's check for payment


So, for under $2 you get instant cash. truckers carry them all the time and sign their own names on them. that way, unlike travelers checks, if they're lost or stolen, they can't be cashed. [i was told this by a trucker as he bought $3000 worth to cover expenses on the road, like tires.]

here's a list of countries for those who want to know:

Albania
Anguilla
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Barbados1
Belize
Bolivia2
British Virgin Islands
Canada
Cape Verde2
Dominica
Dominican Republic2
Ecuador2
El Salvador ($500 maximum)
Grenada
Guinea2
Guyana ($500 maximum)
Honduras2
Jamaica3
Japan4
Mali2
Mexico2
Montserrat
Peru
Saint Christopher and Nevis
Saint Lucia
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
Sierra Leone2
Trinidad and Tobago3

disclaimers are on the site if needed.

[MagickalMemories]

Ah. Checks and the vagaries surrounding them.
You guys are all up in my home, now. LOL

I've been in banking for 12+ years. I've been a teller, a "banker," a manager, customer service for large commercial customers and, now, technical support for some of our financial products. While much of my knowledge from my "branch level" days is gray, this is still something I know well.

I'm going to start @ the first post & work my way down... so you may be listed twice in here:

@Medevl
I do not accept or send checks. In addition to the issues I'll mention in specific response to comments/questions in other posts, there's also the idea of fraud on my account. If I write you a check, you've got ALL of the necessary information to start stealing from me (Routing #, acct#, check # range, my signature, my address). With a home computer, easily purchased check stock, and easily available software, you can write checks on my account to your hearts desire.

@kturock
Branches cannot clear checks in minutes or hours. The BEST they can do is find out if the money is available at that specific point in time, and many banks won't release that information over the phone. When a bank accepts a check from another bank (at the branch level), it's typically doing so "blind."
Also, unless your account is (a) new or (b) has a history of overdrafts/NSF/returned deposited checks, banks won't usually place holds on the check funds until the check reaches a certain dollar amount. Different banks have different ways of handling this, but it's usually amounts in the multiple thousands (say, $2500+).

@sumo
Holding a check until it clears doesn't help you. The idea that the bank puts a hold on it for X days and, because that hold's off and the funds are available means the check was good is a misconception that scammers rely on. If the bank puts a 10 day hold on your check, that doesn't mean it'll clear within 10 days. Many times - a LOT of times - it takes 12 to 14 days for an check to be returned. There are thousands of people out there who sold items to people out of state and accepted "Bank Checks" (often sending back the "accidentally" overpaid excess), only to have the check returned as "bad" two or 3 days later that can attest to this.
The next time you're in your bank, ask an experienced teller about this. Believe me... any teller with 2+ years experience can probably tell you some SERIOUS stories about what can, will, and has gone wrong with accepting checks from strangers and mistrusting "hold" periods.

@Medevl
Yes. All banks charge fees for returned items. It's in the agreement you signed when you opened the account. It costs the bank money to process the bad check each time. It's unfair to expect them to eat the cost. You're responsible for the items you deposit to/cash against your account.
Like I said, look at the checking agreement you signed. You already agreed to it.

@shane
I hope you read my message to sumo, above.

@Adunaphel
I don't do checks at all. Good for you for accepting them from the people you trust... but I just can't do it. Accidents can and do happen, after all.

You're right, though. Times really ARE tough for banks. Every time they turn around, "Occupiers" and others are painting them as the bad guys for excessive fees. Are SOME outrageous? Sure. That's how they make their money, though. Joe Schmoe's $125.50 average balance doesn't earn the bank enough interest to cover the costs associated with maintaining his account, and he STILL expects free checking, but screams when he's charged an "outrageous" fee for overdrawing his account? :eye roll:
Now, Uncle Sam's getting involved. He's making the banks reduce their fees on all kinds of things. Those savings are only forwarded to the customer when it's coming straight from the banks, though. Know how the government recently mandated the MOST that a company could be charged for a credit card transaction? Well, the banks reduced what they charge the business. Do you think the businesses are reducing THEIR costs, though?
Same things for overdraft fees. Banks get "dinged" for excessive fees, but that is what keeps them running. Reduce all the fee income, and you lose banks. Lose too many banks and a few unscrupulous ones get the run of the market and do whatever the *F* they want... or just keep you from having an acct in the first place.

@kt
banks don't like USPS M.O.'s because they're easily and often counterfeited, and they have no way to guarantee the item's valid. That, however, is the same for checks from "other" banks. They're all viewed the same.
I LOVE USPS M.O.'s for sending to Canada, on the rare "no PayPal" occasion, and they're the ONLY form of payment I take that isn't PayPal.


Eric

[kturock]

MM, we were told, that banks don't want USPS in the 'money handling' business. When I was a window clerk, I had customers tell me, that they went to their bank to cash the MO and it was refused. It would have to be cashed & held like any check or MO.
That's the thing about cashing them at the post office. we have a list, that shows what's good & bad. If it's not on the list, it's good to go and cashed instantly. No holds, no waiting. [except for the line out front].

[MagickalMemories]

Well, I can't speak for the banking industry at large. I know that, at my bank, nothing bad was ever said about USPS M.O.'s in general. In fact, it was always one we were happier to see because, if we couldn't cash it, we could direct them to the closest USPS.

If the MO was refused for cashing, it was all about the CUSTOMER and their relationship to the bank (if they even had one - more on this in a moment) than it is about the USPS. They, of course, will not tell YOU that, because it makes THEM look bad, instead of us. God forbid they should accept responsibility for their own actions. LOL

As for the "relationship" comment - you'd be surprised (or, maybe not) how often a NON customer (someone without an account at a bank) will walk into that bank and demand that they cash whatever is being presented to them at that moment. It's worse when the item's from that bank, but the person cashing it doesn't have an account there or a valid ID. Then, it's like we're the Great Devourer, trying to eat their souls, steal their money, and conspire to keep them from getting ahead in the world.

"Yes, Mr Jacobsen. This entire banks exists only to keep you from cashing that one $200 check."

Eric