Shipping to Italy - beyond anecdotal

[specs.esd]

MagickalMemories made a comment in another thread recently regarding shipping to Italy - I had included that very precautionary statement in my preceding response but removed it prior to Submit because I do not have any first hand postal issues with deliveries to said country, nor do (admittedly few) Sellers on eBay I have occasional contact with.

I've posted 8 deliveries to Italy in the past three years with no lost package issues, some >$100: three were USPS Priority International, the remaining were USPS First Class International or equivalent, all had customs forms. One package took over a month to arrive (thank you Economy Parcel Post!) but outside of that I have no negative experiences. Heck, I've had much, much worse fortune in shipping to/receiving from Canada!

I remember back in the early half of the decade France used to be the Eye of Terror from which no package ever returned, yet I never lost a package during or since; does anyone have direct experience with packages to Italy disappearing once it passes through the Italian border, or is it just limited to reading what some other guy posted? eBay forums have "I've heard about problems with Italy" or "I've read on some forums that Italy..." - I'm assuming that there is some basis of truth in issues with Italy's delivery system, but if it is indeed primarily anecdotal does Italy really warrant the 'negative publicity'?

[Stanislav]

I personally have only had one trade in the country of Italy, and of course, it wasn't good. Lost like a shadow in the dark. I was out $150 to pay the person back. There are better ways to ship now than there were at that time, but bad memories are lifelong. That was just my bad experience, only because I bucked the system and thought I could be the one that got through. I know there have been others recently just speaking to a few friends here and there, but there is no way I would do it without some serious back-up protection, so much that it would totally make it uneconomical to do so.

But hey, that's just one person chiming in. Good that you had decent trades in Italy, I just won't give it another chance to get a bite of me.

[Adunaphel]

I did three sales to Italy during my days on eBay. EVERY one never made it. The last one I shipped the "packaging" arrived at the buyers house about 7 months after I shipped it and it was empty. The first two NEVER arrived. Ever.

I don't trade or sell to anybody in Italy anymore. Not gonna happen.

Karl

[HarlequinZero]

I've had several negative experiences with shipping to Italy when I used to sell models on eBay. It's just a matter of the shipping method you choose. Most people want to use the cheapest available method that doesn't take months. So basically that means 1st Class Airmail from the US. (When I lived in the US.) Three times I sent via this method and three times I had the package go missing. After that I still allowed shipping to Italy, but ONLY is the person forked out for global express or UPS. After that, no negative experiences. So Italy isn't exactly the shipping black hole, but IF you ship there I STRONGLY recommend requiring the most secure postal service you can get. If the other person isn't willing to do this my advice would be to pass.

And while I've never had a package go missing to France I've had two packages go "missing" according to the receiver. Thankfully I had tracking on them and they were quickly dealt with by PayPal for submitting a false claim of non-delivery.

[specs.esd]

Well alrighty then - three responses within 6 hours detailing their personal, nightmarish shipping experiences to the armpit of the Mediterranean; that is enough to convince me.

[MagickalMemories]

Though you stated you were convinced, I thought it appropriate to mention my own issue, since it was my statement that inspired you to ask.

I used to paint & sell painted minis on Feebay, 5+ years ago. I sold one VERY WELL painted model (for no small amount) to an Italian guy in 2001 or so (I only recall that it was shortly before or after the 9/11 attacks).
A month after sending, he sent me a message, accusing me of not sending it and threatening to turn me in and leave me a negative reference. I still had my receipt and the customs form #.
I responded by telling him that I still had those and suggesting that I would just have the package tracked using the customs number to see if it arrived (at the time, I thought I *could* do that, so I stated my claim with fervent confidence) and that, if it turned out that he had it, I'd leave HIM a negative with specific details that he tried to scam me.
I never heard from him again (and no ref's were received or given because of it). I presumed he was lying.

Added into the horror stories I'd heard about shipping to Italy, I decided that my ONE issue would be my ONLY issue.

Eric

[osloco]

My first feebay experience was bought by someone in Italy, they took forever to pay. I sent the package using Canada Post. I am pretty sure it arrived, but the guy was awful and either didn't speak english or was a jackass. He never left feedback, and I probably wouldn't post there again.

[kturock]

Short and simple answer here.
I work with a guy who owns a house in Italy for when he and his wife retires.
When he goes on an extended vactaion there, 3-4 weeks, he has his mail held. He doesn't want anything shipped there.
His comment when asked why was, " Oh God, It'd never make it."

No reasons, but his description of the area is, 'a nice place to visit, or to retire and die'...

[mrrshann618]

My example is much the same as kturocks.
I have a friend who lives in Italy, near the Slovenian border, I've never had problems shipping things to them (books and such) however they have flat out said that they do not trust their own mailing system. Then again I usually ship it global ex as most of the time it is things such as B-day and X-mas gifts

[Norseman]

I have had many positive experiences shipping into Europe even Spain which had a big black mark on them for awhile.. With no problems... I never shipped to Italy so i can not comment on that.

My concern is this...

specs.esd wrote:

Heck, I've had much, much worse fortune in shipping to/receiving from Canada!

Being Canadian I face a lot of people not wanting to ship to Canada every day. Some because of the customs some because of the %30 higher shipping fees.

But I have to take exception to this comment. I have been trading, hell it feels like forever, but I think it has been about 15-16 years now. I have trade probably in excess of $20,000 of GW materials over the years. I have had 3 packages that did not show up coming to me. I have had no packages get lost with me as the sender. Hell I have had them take a month and a half, going in and out, but that was only once or twice. The three packages that I did not receive, I am pretty convinced that they were never shipped. The sender just acted funny in each experience, and it was only a few bucks worth of minis and we came to an amicable solution in each case.

I know there are scammers out there on both sides of the border, and there are people who abuse the system everywhere. The mail system is pretty secure in North America and I would deem a lost package suspicious in every case. If the person can not prove they sent it, I would think that they never did.

As the Canadian Watchman Please send me a PM if you have any less than positive experiences with Canadian traders. Even if you do not feel the experience is worth a negative feedback or a BTR.

Trade safe rules.
#1 Keep records.
#2 Obtain proof.
#3 Cover your a$$.

[kturock]

While I don't want to thread-jack, I have to add my .02 in and agree with Norseman.

For those who don't know, I work for USPS. I was a window clerk for 3.5 years. The area I live and work in has a high tourist and seasonal population. Alot come from Canada. Shipping to Canada was/is, as Norseman said, higher than US shipping, it can be slow, and customs can be difficult and/or expensive.

The other countries that had few problems with security are UK and most of Europe. It seemed the 'less developed' the country, the more problems and corruption.
Most of South America was a crap shoot. The smaller countries were the worst.

[Ironhide]

Isn't Canada part of NAFTA? Why is it so hard to trade with them?







In case some of you don't realize it, I'm being facetious.

[kturock]

NAFTA has nothing to do with incoming and outgoing items through customs.

It has to do with the rates and items allowed by the government to enter the country on a national level, not on a personal level.

[Ironhide]

Someone didn't read the fine print.

[kturock]

some of us can't even see the fine print.