Rash of difficult trades

[jquest]

I'm just throwing the question out there, I seem to be running into lots of trades where the items in the box aren't what was agreed upon. For example:

GK termi lot missing all of their little shields and a psycannon. Items mailed after contacted but never rx'd.

Large IG lot missing 25 troopers. Legs were there but no torsos, quickly resolved the issue.

Large Necron lot, poorly packed, late shipping, broken bits, missing flying sprues. Still being resolved.

PAGK lot, I clearly asked for all halberd PAGK's. Rx'd 2 Halberds, 1 Justicar, 1 Psycannon, 1 Incinerator.

I didn't know if I was the only one having these issues. I don't want to leave a BTR, but goodness, it seems to be consistent? I was looking at one individual who packed poorly, I left a curt ref, but now people have been leaving Bad refs for his/her poor packing jobs with bits being missing or broken. Maybe if I would have addressed the issue a year ago, people wouldn't be having problems today. Poor packing is not the post office's fault! Any thoughts?

-Ryan

[Ironhide]

You don't have to give them a BTR, just give them appropriate feedback.

GK termi lot missing all of their little shields and a psycannon. Items mailed after contacted but never rx'd.

Negative ref.

Large IG lot missing 25 troopers. Legs were there but no torsos, quickly resolved the issue.

Neutral ref.

Large Necron lot, poorly packed, late shipping, broken bits, missing flying sprues. Still being resolved.

Negative ref, if he resolves it then a neutral is appropriate.

PAGK lot, I clearly asked for all halberd PAGK's. Rx'd 2 Halberds, 1 Justicar, 1 Psycannon, 1 Incinerator.

Negative ref. Didn't send the items agreed upon.

Regardless if you resolve your trades, the trades themselves are based on your experience. If the trade experience did not go well, then you need to consider a negative or neutral reference. If everything went smooth with no problems, then a good ref is appropriate.

[Adunaphel]

While I agree with most of what is said here, I disagree with this one:

Large IG lot missing 25 troopers. Legs were there but no torsos, quickly resolved the issue.

Neutral ref.

People make mistakes. Things happen. If the trader quickly fixed the problem I don't think there is any reason to leave them anything other than a positive. That's just my opinion and I am not making excuses for anybody. It just seems that lately traders have become rather grumpy about some things (blowing things out of proportion). While I understand the OP's frustration at having such a bad run of luck, that particular trade doesn't seem so bad to me. Maybe I'm just more mellow than most.

Lastly, what does "rx'd" mean? If it's received, then it doesn't make sense. I am having a geriatric moment (or a grumpy old trader moment )...

Karl

[redstarone]

While I agree with most of what is said here, I disagree with this one:

Large IG lot missing 25 troopers. Legs were there but no torsos, quickly resolved the issue.

Neutral ref.

People make mistakes. Things happen. If the trader quickly fixed the problem I don't think there is any reason to leave them anything other than a positive. That's just my opinion and I am not making excuses for anybody. It just seems that lately traders have become rather grumpy about some things (blowing things out of proportion). While I understand the OP's frustration at having such a bad run of luck, that particular trade doesn't seem so bad to me. Maybe I'm just more mellow than most.

Lastly, what does "rx'd" mean? If it's received, then it doesn't make sense. I am having a geriatric moment (or a grumpy old trader moment )...

Karl

Thats exactly how I feel.

---Matt

[fitterpete]

If someone forgets to ship a piece or two and they send them later I wouldn't personaly leave a neutral ref.#@it happens , if they make it up thats fine.Some people are totally perfect(I have never forgot to send anything myself, but it's not me) but I keep waiting for the time it does happen to me and think how I wouldn't want a neutral for something like that.
Poor packing is something I always struggle with.If you look at my refs and have read the PMs I get from receivers, I get a lot of good comments on my packing skill.So it really irks me when I get something all FUBARed cause somebody didn't pack it right.But I never leave a neg or neutral for it,usually I tell them in the PM acknowleding receipt that maybe next time they could try packing a little better.
This is just my way I'm not telling anyone this is the only way or the Bartertown Way.
Pete

[Ironhide]

Large IG lot missing 25 troopers. Legs were there but no torsos, quickly resolved the issue.

Neutral ref.

Missing a small piece is one thing, but missing a whole platoon of imperial guard is totally different. Besides the fact, if you were shipping a whole army wouldn't you double (or triple) check everything, to make sure it was there? I would.
Mostly for the fact that I don't want to have to ship something to the same address twice.

[JohnHwangBT]

Ryan:

In general, if it's a minor thing, and fixed quickly, then I wouldn't ding them over it.

If they put me through a lot of trouble, then I might go to a Neutral.

If they don't deliver, or refuse to make good, then BTR / Bad

/John

[jquest]

I appreciate all of the feedback. Rx'd is received, sorry I should have spelled it out. I guess I just need to be a little tougher with my refs....by not leaving a ref when something is screwy isn't the answer. I like to try and give people a chance to resolve the issue, a Bad Ref is pretty tough on the rating...but you earn what you get...

-Ryan

[Ironhide]

...but you earn what you get...

Couldn't have said it better!

[MagickalMemories]

GK termi lot missing all of their little shields and a psycannon. Items mailed after contacted but never rx'd.

Negative ref.

Agreed 100%.

Large IG lot missing 25 troopers. Legs were there but no torsos, quickly resolved the issue.

Neutral ref.

Half agree. If the guy responded quickly and sent the rest fast, a positive might be appropriate with a small notation that he forgot to send part at first but swiftly rectified the situation. Everyone screws up. The problem isn't THAT we screw up. It's how we fix it when we do.

Honestly, if everyone looked at it as cut & dried as IH did above (not that it's BAD that he does, mind you), I'd have 5 or 6 neutrals, probably.

Large Necron lot, poorly packed, late shipping, broken bits, missing flying sprues. Still being resolved.

Negative ref, if he resolves it then a neutral is appropriate.

I think this is a correct assessment.

PAGK lot, I clearly asked for all halberd PAGK's. Rx'd 2 Halberds, 1 Justicar, 1 Psycannon, 1 Incinerator.

Negative ref. Didn't send the items agreed upon.

100% spot on.

Regardless if you resolve your trades, the trades themselves are based on your experience. If the trade experience did not go well, then you need to consider a negative or neutral reference. If everything went smooth with no problems, then a good ref is appropriate.

emphasis mine.

The emboldened text above is a SERIOUSLY important factor of leaving references that not enough people consider. How the trade went is SUBJECTIVE. He might think it was wonderful, while you're thinking it sucked big-time.
Just because HE leaves YOU a positive does NOT obligate you to do the same. You are under no obligation to leave ANY reference. Typically, though, it IS considered bad manners NOT to (ESPECIALLY if he deserved a positive).
In the opinions of MANY traders, especially the more experienced ones, we have a duty to each other, as a community, to properly report ALL trades. Did he deserve a negative? Give it to him. He'll be pissed. So? if you had THAT bad a trade with him, you weren't going to trade with him anyway. if he leaves YOU a negative in revenge... Well, it'll tak an Admin about 3 minutes to remove it (GENEROUS estimate) and about 3 more to ban him permanently, as "revenge negatives" are a bannable offense.
Even if he sucks it up and eats the negative as deserved, you've done a service to everyone he trades with, from here on out. They'll be more careful with him, and he won't get away with that stuff.


Lastly, you need to reexamine how YOU are conducting trades.
How specific are you beign about the items you're receiving?
If someone's offering you GK's, and you specify that you only want Halberd GK's, require that they acknowledge that specification.
If they say something's "primed," make sure that it wasn't "painted," them primed over that.
If they say it's assembled, ask if it's also painted, primed, mold lines cleaned, assembled WELL, etc.

Sadly, you shouldn't HAVE to jump through all those hoops... but your trades will be better off for it. Nobody's going to watch out for you as well as YOU.

Ask anyone who's traded with me. Unless I knew them before hand, and already knew how they conducted their trades, I ask about a bajillion tedious questions. If you forget to answer one, I ask it again. If I don't like your answer, or think it's not clear enough, I ask for clarification. It's gotten me a bit of a reputation for being a little A N A L in trading, but people know I'm treating my own side of the trade with as much scrutiny, so it goes both ways.

Eric

[Massawyrm]

Sounds to me like your biggest problem is that you're not having the senders take photos before agreeing upon a trade. If you're going to be picky about what you receive (which you have every right to be) you should also be demanding enough to ask for pictures to begin with. It would solve virtually ALL of these problems.

People don't tend to look at what you leave for other people, and unless you build a rep as a TOTAL DOUCHE about it, no one will ever hear that you are tough on trade refs. Solving this all begins with what you ask for before a deal. A reputable trader will always be willing to take that extra step if they have the means to.

[mrrshann618]

While pictures does help, it really doesn't help in asll situations. I've gotten pictures of figurines before, only to have the individual not know how to pack them, instead of getting these great models that were part of the picture, I got a giant metal/plastic jigsaw puzzle.

I was so ticked off once about the condition that in order to figure out if I recieved everything I basically had to re-build what was sent. Then I proceeded to ship them back as the figures were not in the condition mentioned, there were missing figures (with different figures to replace what was missing). I was much nicer as I actually included padding for the return trip.

[Massawyrm]

While pictures does help, it really doesn't help in asll situations. I've gotten pictures of figurines before, only to have the individual not know how to pack them, instead of getting these great models that were part of the picture, I got a giant metal/plastic jigsaw puzzle.

I was so ticked off once about the condition that in order to figure out if I recieved everything I basically had to re-build what was sent. Then I proceeded to ship them back as the figures were not in the condition mentioned, there were missing figures (with different figures to replace what was missing). I was much nicer as I actually included padding for the return trip.

Sure - but if you read his specific complaints, each one could have been avoided if he had requested photos beforehand.

[jquest]

Sure - but if you read his specific complaints, each one could have been avoided if he had requested photos beforehand.

To a point, someone says they have 5 guys with lasguns, then you get 2 lasguns, 1 grenade launcher & 2 guys with no arms, the person sending should know better. I will start asking for pictures before each trade, but when it's a basic model and I'm not looking for paint quality there shouldn' be that many surprises. But, there seems to be, so yes, I do need to get pictures first.

-Ryan

[blackspade]

While my trades have all gone well in general, I have had a few issues, that while minor, have marred otherwise great experiences. Not enough to ding folks off of good, because all trade conditions were met, but bothersome just the same.
One of my recent trades ended up being painted and the figures were clipped off of the tabs, while another had some detail clipped off for some reason. I had made an assumption that the figs would be bare metal and/or undamaged, but I didn't specifically ask, so some of the onus is on me. That said it should be common courtesy to let folks know if there are any 'issues' with any of the figures in a lot, if not in the trade posting, then during the negotiations.

The other thing I find occasionally bothersome is folks not being timely with trade references. I know that there is no obligation to post them, but references are one of the ways that Bartertown works and it would be nice if folks could be more timely about posting them. For instance, if I send goods/money first, I should be getting a positive post upon reciept and not have to wait for until I recieve and post a reference for them to get mine. The reverse is true, and if someone sends me stuff first, I feel an obligation to give them their reference at that time. Trade references only take a moment and one should be especially mindful after a trade has been completed to post references for folks who have already posted on them.

Finally, one of my pet peeves is folks not responding at all to PMs. If you are soliciting for something and you recieve a response, at least be courtious and respond with a 'no thanks'! I know some folks are slow about responding or are not on often, but even if you are considering other offers, it is always nice to let folks know.

Sorry for the rant! Whew!

Overall, my trading here has been great and thanks to all who have traded with me in the past and will in the future!