Trade related Question. Need Guidance

[jlong05]

So I had a weird issue happen and really have no idea how I can/should proceed. Any suggestions from other experienced traders would be great.

Set up an international trade with 'Trader'(Name left out on purpose)

Trader shipped first as their rating was lower and package arrived roughly 2 weeks later. Unfortunately, the package was damaged and multiple bits and models were missing from the package. This was an international trade also, which explains the delay in delivery. I contacted the trader and we identified a value that we both acceptable as what was now missing. The Trader asked it I could use other models he had(however his remaining models would not work for my needs) He also have some game books that I could use though. We re-negotiated the trade based on what was currently delivered and the new game book for what I had to ship to him and I offered to pay(Paypal) the difference we now had plus split the cost of shipping. It was also agreed that since he had shipped part of the 'new' trade I would send the paypal now to help him with the shipping on the game book.

This was all completed 2/7/09 and the Paypal payment was sent. Since that point I have sent 2 follow-up PMs. one on 2/15 and another on 2/19. Both have been read, neither has been given a response.

My question is: As he is now ignoring my messages is this a backout or a bad trader? He 'did' ship originally, and I did get some of what was supposed to come. I did pay his some cash which has a rough value of 'close' to what he sent but that was for the shipping on the re-negotiated trade.

Help. If this is a backout or a bad trader I will be posting a full thread in the respective forum after sending one final PM to the trader in question asking for followup with the indication it would then escalate.

Now. Last note is. This trade was not done with the user known as 'the-trader'. Just didn't want any confusion.

Thanks,

[MagickalMemories]

Wow, man.
That's quite a pickle.

Sounds more like a 'bad trade' to me.
Even though he's already sent you SOMETHING, he hasn't completed his end of the bargain, though you've provided funds for him to do so.

As a side note, I would not have paid until after the "replacement items" were received.


Eric

[kturock]

i'd say it's all based on $ amount.

if the original deal was a large $ value, it should have been insured. if he didn't then it's his fault; for not offering it or not adding it. bad trader ref, if you don't get the items, neutral if you do.

if he offered and he declined, then it both of yours fault; you for not asking, him for not offering.

if you don't get anything, then definately a bad trader ref, and file with usps for mail fraud. you paid him and he was going to ship it via us mail.

it's a bad trade. did he pack the things well? were they insured? if yes, then it was just bad luck, but you've since paid him for more.

[jlong05]

To clarify, origination was the UK. So it was shipped without insurance and tracking, as you all know international insurance and tracking is ridiculous. As for packing(It was all in a paperish mailpak and all the models were wrapped in paper towel. Honestly, if some dropped out, it wouldn't have surprised me to think that the mail carrier would have thought it was just packing material. The bag at the time of delivery was ripped open on the side, of which I had taken pics. It was through that rip that items must have fallen out.

As for me paying, it was more a matter of me wanting to feel better about the situation as he had shipped stuff. What I paid in UK pounds was approximately the value of what he had shipped. I have no problem marking the remainder of the trade as a backout with a warning to others, as I am not out any actual value as I got models equaling close to what he shipped. It now is more a matter of what is 'safe' for me if I were to repost the items he wanted for trade again. I don't know if there is 'mail fraud' though as I think any court would see what I paid as value for what he did ship, even though it is a much larger issue than that.

Thanks for the feedback guys.

[JohnHwangBT]

As I understand things:
1. You agreed to a trade.
2. He sent first, but shipment was damaged.
3. You agreed to a revised trade, with you paying towards shipping
4. You sent payment on Feb. 7.
5. No or replies to messages since Feb.15 / FEb. 19.


It has been 2 weeks since you paid, and you're still waiting for the rest of what he owes you to complete the trade.

So, here's how I see things moving forward:

- Technically, as he needs to send you stuff so that you can complete the deal, I think this is probably closest to a backout situation, and may warrant a Neutral feedback.


However, if we convert the deal to a purchase / sale, did you "overpay" or was it "discounted" based on the "fair value" of what you received?

- If you overpaid by any significant amount, then it's more like a BTR, as, on net, you are owed goods that you have paid for. I would request proof of shipment by week's end.

- If you got an a good "discount", then you might close things with him and move on without any BTR / feedback at all. In this case, I'd send a note to close the deal unless he decides to move forward by week's end.

Regardless, send a "final" note with a clear deadline (Friday / end of month / whatever), with clear language of what you expect and what you would prefer. That way, you can move on, rather than leaving things unsettled.

[jlong05]

Thanks for the final comment. I actually followed that mostly as earlier today I did sent a final note. I think if the trader in question responds. says he backed out, gives a reason, whatever I will leave it as a backout. As I did pay some money(which the value of what he sent is somewhat in question as it was mostly OOP items) if he again ignores the PM and lets the deadline pass without comment(Friday BTW) I will move forward with a Bad Trader report. I really hate to do that though unless it is VERY clear. As there is a lot of grey on this trade I wanted to get other opinions also.

Thanks again,