Why isn't there a 0 feedback option?

CypherIsGod · Post by **CypherIsGod** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:58 am

Here is the situation I have. I accepted a trade for an RPG book for my marine bikes. The other person has a 4 rating (2 good trades, nothing looks fishy), so I kindly asked him to ship first. He had no problem and said he would ship the book out asap. After a week, I contacted him and asked if it was sent media rate since it had taken so long. He responded that he did ship media rate. I guess I can understand this as the book is 500 pages, so it's heavy.

Another week goes by and I try to contact him again to see if he had a tracking number, or something. It took me another PM a couple days later to get a response. He said he went down to the PO and they said there was nothing they could do because he did not track it at all. I don't know if I believe him or not.

I would like to leave cautionary feedback about this in case it becomes a common excuse with this trader. The problem is I do not want to leave a negative, because if he is telling the truth, he is out a $50 book and will have a very hard time trading on B-Town with an effective -6 rating. But I also do not want to leave a neutral because that actually adds 1 point to the rating. He certainly does not deserve that. So, I'm trying to figure out what to do and would love some advice. Thanks guys.

PS - To add on to this, I have another trade that I did around the same day as this one. That person will not even respond to my PMs now. So, maybe I am just fed up with new people on here that can't deliver.... I dunno.

Stanislav · Post by **Stanislav** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 4:16 am

CIG,
To kind of answer the question, a neutral leaves "1". It is actually as an alert almost as good as the negative. Why? Because feedback is left in even numbers, so if you see someone with an odd number of feedback points, you can see immediately that something has gone against them at sometime. A "0" would neither add or subtract, and unless you read the feedback, you would have no idea that anything had gone wrong in the past. I am actually in favor of negatives being "-9" instead of "-10". Not a great expalnation and I am sure another will come behind me and word it better.

As for your trade, I know how infuriating it can be, but give him a little more time in my opinion. Dumping a negative or a neutral is still "final" and he may deserve the neutral, but wait until you recieve it (hopefully). If he is new with 2 trades under his belt, he may have made a blunder and not used DC as an inexperienced mistake.

Up to you, and like I said, only an opinion. Hope you can make out what I was trying to say, it has been a long day.

peacemystic · Post by **peacemystic** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 4:58 am

If it was me,i'd wait another week or so,sometime media mail can take a looooonnnng time to arrive,and don't quote me on this one,but i'm not sure you can get a comformation number on media mail.
Did you request that he used a comformation number?,if not you can't really knock if for not using one,(not smart on his part,but he is a new trader).
but thats just me
Cheers

Stanislav · Post by **Stanislav** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:02 am

Media Mail allows the use of DC. I just did it

BDWilliams · Post by **BDWilliams** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:16 am

I don't mean to threadjack, but I am in a similar position. I had a trade with a newer member (feedback of 2 at the time) and he had no problem shipping first. I received his package, but a bunch of bits were missing. He said he would send them out, but it's been over a month and nothing. Now the cost of the bits would have been nothing really, but now GW no longer sells them leaving me with 8 models with no weapons.
I want to warn others, but feel that since he did send me the models a negative reference seems stiff. On the other hand I feel that adding to his references feels wrong as well. Stanislav makes a good point about odd feedback. Would it be enough to warn others?
Joe-

Stanislav · Post by **Stanislav** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:34 am

As stated at the bottom of the feedback form:

Good: You would trade with this person all of the time, everything is as advertised or better, good packaging, on time.
Neutral: The items were a bit late, some were bent and broken, not quite what you want but its not worth a refund. You would trade with this person still.
Bad: The items were grossly misrepresented or ripped you off. You would never trade with this person again.

( 832 ) · Post by **MagickalMemories** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:23 am

I'll comment on BDW first, because his is easiest/fastest:

IMO, don't ship your stuff until you receive what you were promised.
I mean, that was part of the bargain so, if you hold his (whatever) for a couple weeks while you're waiting for the arms, that is NOT a bad trade practice. It is, simply, following your agreement (that they ship first).

CIG, our history considered, I hope you won't look at my post through veiled eyes:

If you didn't agree on HOW it would be sent, I don't see where the trader's done anything (that can be proven yet, anyway) deserving a negative, or even a neutral.
If, once you receive the package, the postmark matches the information you received and the book is in the condition you were promised, he hasn't technically done anything wrong.
I don't see where anything but a positive is warranted. After all, it's not the sender's fault if the USPS is slow with delivery. KWIM?

What he said about not being able to track it is true. If he did not put a DC on it (which, as Stanis said, you CAN do... I just did it myself on Saturday), then it is just "out there." Esp. with media mail. Media mail is the last of the last of the lowest priorities.
I once sent a game Media Mail to Hawaii for an Ebay auction... I kid you not, the dang thing took over 2 and a half MONTHS to arrive.

All that being said, I am with you. I would like there to be a Zero option, as well.

Eric

deadmeat30 · Post by **deadmeat30** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:04 am

Im with stanislav on this, if there a '0' feedback rating, then no one will tell on the rating scores. atleast with a '1' you can clearly see it on the forum (unless they have done 2 neautral trades, heh) but at least it'll draw you into checking out the trade refs before you even consider a trade.

just my 2 pence

Alan

CypherIsGod · Post by **CypherIsGod** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:08 am

I guess the thing I missed here is the fact that media mail could possibly take that long. The package was supposed to be shipped out on Feb 7th. We're looking at close to a month here. I calculated it out (thanks Google maps!) and it would only take me 21 days to get from there to here walking 12 hours each day. I figured even media mail rate should be able to match that pace. Although with the short month and 1 federal holiday, it will only be 20 working days for them come today.

I would never consider giving a negative, or even a neutral feedback due to the post office. I had a deal that took over a month because of Canadian customs. I happily left a good feedback rating for that trade. And I will for this one too. I don't even care if he didn't ship it when he said he did. As long as the book arrives, my marine bikes go out the next day.

The problem now is I have to wait before I get the book. I was planning on running a game with the book, and I don't want to go buy it now, in case the package happens to come in. Just based on the feedback from you guys, I'll give it another 2 weeks. If nothing comes in, then I'll figure out what to do.

Thanks for the help guys. Even you MM.

And I didn't realize we a "history". I know we had one argument about something, but that's all I can remember. If there was more, let me know. I'm the king of holding grudges, and I don't want to give up that title!

( 832 ) · Post by **MagickalMemories** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:51 pm

CypherIsGod wrote:And I didn't realize we a "history". I know we had one argument about something, but that's all I can remember. If there was more, let me know. I'm the king of holding grudges, and I don't want to give up that title!

LOL

Nothing major.
I don't hold grudges, hardly, at all... so I don't even remember the details.

It was just a difference of opinion, IMO... I just know that not everyone is as quick to forget as I am, so I always tread the waters lightly until I know.

Now, as far as the delivery time vs. walking... Welcome to the US Postal Service!

I hope everything works out.

Oh, and one more thing:

I don't even care if he didn't ship it when he said he did.

You're a heck of a lot nicer about it than I am. If I'm told, "I shipped it today," and the postmark is for AFTER that day... I'm not letting it ride. KWIM?

Eric

CypherIsGod · Post by **CypherIsGod** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:28 pm

MagickalMemories wrote: You're a heck of a lot nicer about it than I am. If I'm told, "I shipped it today," and the postmark is for AFTER that day... I'm not letting it ride. KWIM?

Yeah, I guess if someone lies about a ship date, that will definitely get them a neutral in my book. Good point.

vesrian · Post by **vesrian** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 4:47 pm

Neutral was changed to +0 a while ago.

( 832 ) · Post by **MagickalMemories** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:04 pm

vesrian wrote:Neutral was changed to +0 a while ago.

.

Really?
I don't remember any announcement on that.

Well, cool. That would solve that.

Eric

wookieegunner · Post by **wookieegunner** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:04 pm

CypherIsGod wrote:I guess the thing I missed here is the fact that media mail could possibly take that long. The package was supposed to be shipped out on Feb 7th. We're looking at close to a month here. I calculated it out (thanks Google maps!) and it would only take me 21 days to get from there to here walking 12 hours each day. I figured even media mail rate should be able to match that pace. Although with the short month and 1 federal holiday, it will only be 20 working days for them come today.

Unless it has changed in the past few years (which I doubt since we are talking about the US Postal System), Media Mail works via the pallette method. It gets stuck on a pallette at the local post office. When the pallette is full it gets sent to their regonal location where it is put on another pallette. When that pallette gets full it is sent to the next hop where it is put on a pallette, until that one gets full. This keeps happening until it gets to your local post office. If we assume walking at 5 miles an hour that means you are approximating 1200 miles between you. That is probably at minimum two regional post offices (yours and his) so that is three pallettes, each of which sit until they are full (which could take 1 day or 1 year).

I used to be in a group that coverred most of the SE (TN, AL, GA, LA, AR) and they were constantly having late newsletters because of this. It actually was bad enough that the editors had to find out why and publish the reason (you could pay extra for first class shipping and it wasn't uncommon to have a 2 week difference between the ones shipped 1st class and the ones sent Media).

CypherIsGod · Post by **CypherIsGod** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:29 am

Actually I was being generous to the postal service and figured 3 MPH on the walking speed. It is coming from NC and I am in NY.

I had no idea media rate was so bad. Thank god I never succumbed to the temptation of ultra-cheap shipping. I will never accept media rate shipping in a trade again.