Bartertown.com

Hey all, pure newbie here. I've been lurking for a while (actually registered a ways back and never got around to posting), and I'm getting ready to post my first ad. I had a couple netiquette questions I was hoping to get some advice on. I apologize if there's an FAQ for this that I missed.

1) What is the scale of reputation? Do you gain one point per trade? At what level is someone usually considered trustworthy?

2) As a trader with a low rep., is it impolite to prefer to only trade with people of a rep. above a certain threshold for my first few trades?

Starting out with a 0 Rep, I'll obviously be shipping first for a while, which I'm fine with. However, that being said my concern is that it seems like there's a bit of a hump getting started where you're putting yourself out there to everybody, be they Rep-50 or just 5. I just want to be sure I'm starting off here on the right foot.

Thanks for any advice.

Hello and Welcome.

I will try to answer a couple of your questions.
First off, for every positive reference you receive, you get 2 added to your rating. Neutrals (I am almost sure) add nothing to you ITL rating, and Negative take 10 away.

I would say, to start trading and build a good reputation, you should TRY for traders with a higher standing. Be careful about totally trusting a trader that only has a four rating (or something in that ballpark).

I think it is a good thing that you are willing to ship first, but once again I would be wary unless your trading partner has MANY more references.

It is WISE to actually READ the references. You will get a better feel of your traders by WHAT people write about them more so than their actual number.

Don't forget to read the rules and if you are having trouble with a trade Don't EVER post anything until you read the Bad Trader Reporting rules.

Having said this, enjoy and good luck. I think you will find that alot of guys here are very honest traders. Check their references and if something seems fishy just say no thanks.

Karl

It's not exactly POLITE to refuse to trade with traders with lo rating, but I wouldn't call it IMPOLITE, either.
Adunaphel pretty much covered your questions.

I strongly suggest you read his post AT LEAST one more time, then follow ALL of the advice he gave you.


Eric

I'll definitely take your advice to heart, and of course do my due diligence in deciding whom to trade with. Thanks for the information.

Firelight wrote:
1) What is the scale of reputation? Do you gain one point per trade? At what level is someone usually considered trustworthy?

2) As a trader with a low rep., is it impolite to prefer to only trade with people of a rep. above a certain threshold for my first few trades?

Starting out with a 0 Rep, I'll obviously be shipping first for a while, which I'm fine with. However, that being said my concern is that it seems like there's a bit of a hump getting started where you're putting yourself out there to everybody, be they Rep-50 or just 5. I just want to be sure I'm starting off here on the right foot.

Thanks for any advice.

For me.. someone is considered trustworthy by me at around the 20 mark.. which means they have had 10 trades here that went well with no bad references. The BIGGEST thing I can underscore Adunaphel with is to READ the references.. don't just knee jerk trust someone with a 20 (for example), because they may have had 2 bad refs and started out at a 40..

it is good to know you understand the "lower refs send first" convention... a lot of folks come here with stacks of ebay or other trade site references and demand they are acknowledged here.. which is not the point of this site. Refs here are for trades/sales HERE. Anyone not willing to work within "this system" should probably not be traded with.

My own opinion, of course.

The fact you asked, and want to do the right thing, the right way, speaks volumes to me about your future here.. welcome to Bartertown!

-Porkuslime

@firelight

When I started trading (not that I have an exceptionally high rating) I too was concerned about sending items first, and waiting for payment.
One of the things that I did (and still do) is check the traders references. IMO, a trader with a 20 rating who has been given rave reviews from traders with 100+ ratings are just as good as a trader with a 100+ rating who has only traded with low rated traders. Also, if something seems fishy about their references or in their PM's to you, then you are more than welcome to decide not to trade with them. (Just don't back out once a deal has been struck)
Overall, there are not a lot of scammers on the forums. Just be careful and do a bit of research (reading trade references, emailing/ PMing with the trader) before jumping into a potentially costly trade.

Hope this helps a bit.
-mat

Also, start off with a few small trades rather than trying to offload a $300 unpainted army in one go. Much less risk that way, and also helps build a reputation.

This place is about making deals, if you think the other guy is asking too much for what he is offering, respond with what you consider fair and be prepared to barter (its the name of the place after all!). But at the end of the day if you are not happy with what is being offered, say no thanks and look elsewhere.There is no obligation to agree the trade if you are not happy. HOWEVER, If you do make a deal, honour it.

Do not be upset if you PM people with offers and they ignore you (there are not many crooks here, but unfortunately there are quite a lot of discourteous types)

Always, Always, Always get proof of posting for anything you send (registered shipping is even better if possible) just incase the PO/Customs lose the packet. If you cannot prove you sent something, I and pretty much everyone else is going to assume you did not. (

Pack anything you send well and securely, even unpainted stuff deserves some bubble wrap and tissue paper. Painted figures and padded envelopes do not work

Always make pictures available, and always ask to see the same from the other guy. If they are not clear ask again. Make sure you know what you are getting in trade.

Keep all of your negotiation emails/PMs until the trade is completed and both sides have left feedback. Be wary if a trader says "only email me no PMs) make sure you send a duplicate PM as well so there is proof within the Bartertown System of what is being discussed/agreed..

Oh and.......if there are any OOP Squigs in that forthcoming trade of yours I bags first call

Enjoy yourself here,
RobH

Everything Robh said was dead on with (IMO) one exception:

robh wrote:Be wary if a trader says "only email me no PMs) make sure you send a duplicate PM as well so there is proof within the Bartertown System of what is being discussed/agreed.

I don't think "only via PM" or "only via email" (I've seen both) are anything to worry about.

For Bad Trader Reporting (and proof) purposes, emails are just as valid as PMs.
If you communicate via PM, be certain to always bcc yourself a copy for your records.
If you communicate via email, but PM a copy to him as well, all that shows is that you've been PMing him.
If he only responds via email, your PMs are superfluous.

Eric

robh wrote:

Do not be upset if you PM people with offers and they ignore you (there are not many crooks here, but unfortunately there are quite a lot of discourteous types)

Still Annoys the hell out of me...its just plain rude

Keep all of your negotiation emails/PMs until the trade is completed and both sides have left feedback. Be wary if a trader says "only email me no PMs) make sure you send a duplicate PM as well so there is proof within the Bartertown System of what is being discussed/agreed..

I'm wary of only PM traders myself

Anyways,the Golden rule applys on Btown,just as it does in everyday life "Treat people as you would like to be treated yourself"

Cheers
Steve

Heya, welcome aboard!

My take is:

1. I don't really consider totally "trustworthy" until they they hit 100+. That's 50+ "good" trades.

2. You'll find this funny, but almost all of my early feedback was based on sales and trades to people with lower Feedback than me. I don't think had to ship first or simul until I hit 50+ on Btown, and at that point, I was only dealing with better traders. If you don't want to deal with low Feedback people, that's your perogative. All it means is that you're doing fewer trades, and it's slower for you to build your rating.

Personally, if you're dealing with a 10 rating, they're still not well-established as a trader. That's only 5 trades. I'd be leery of shipping any significant quantity / value ($50+) first.

Finally, some people find the use of eBay or other off-site ratings to be controversial. Personally, I really like them as secondary sources - to me, the more information I can get about a potential trader, the better. If you've got something as a reference that people can check into, that's always better than nothing.

Good luck!

robh wrote:Keep all of your negotiation emails/PMs until the trade is completed and both sides have left feedback.

Be wary if a trader says "only email me no PMs) make sure you send a duplicate PM as well so there is proof within the Bartertown System of what is being discussed/agreed..

Actually, you should keep an off-site backup log of all PMs / e-mails that you exchange, "just in case". Make a file for every trade, and cut and paste every PM into that file. That way, if something goes wierd on Btown, there is still a backup record of the trade.

PM-only or e-mail only doesn't matter, although I like to use the Btown PMs, simply to keep my personal email from clogging up.

Finally, some people find the use of eBay or other off-site ratings to be controversial. Personally, I really like them as secondary sources - to me, the more information I can get about a potential trader, the better. If you've got something as a reference that people can check into, that's always better than nothing.

I agree with you John up to a point. The problem I have had with the "eBay people" is that you can't REALLY do a check to see if the profile they have given you is theirs. At least I haven't found a way. And it is a little tiring when a new trader comes on Bartertown and demands that an experienced trader sends first because they have a 200 rating on eBay. I have had this happen on several occasions. Even when I pointed out that I have a 320+ rating on eBay and I have never had a neutral or negative reference on ANY site, they persist.

It is nice that it is more background, but it could be somebody else's background and there is no way that I know that you can be 100% sure that you are dealing apples for apples with eBay.

I also agree that a newer trader should try to keep his trades smaller with other new traders. In my first post here I tried to stress that just because a trader has a rating of say 10 more than a 0 trader, that does NOT mean that he is completely trustworthy (in fact the two times I have trouble here both traders had between 4-10 ratings and the references were good). I got my stuff in both instances Firelight.

100 seems too high to me to make a trader completely trustworthy. At least in my opinion. There are a lot of guys in the 30-80 bracket that have rave reviews from established traders and I would trust them as much as some of the big guys (over 200). But, everybody has there own tastes. Peacemystic doesn't like PM traders, but I do almost every one of my trades through PM because I feel it is easier to have a trail if something goes wrong. I always seem to have trouble keeping my emails. It could be my wife's fault.

The biggest thing is that if it does seem fishy, then just say no. Usuallly things pop up here again, so you don't have to worry too much about losing out on something.

COMMUNICATION is HUGE in my book. Tell me. Please. If we are in the middle of a trade, please tell me if you do NOT want to go through with it or have found something else that suits your fancy. Common courtesy is rapidly becoming a lost art with some traders. If you get an offer and you don't like it, let them KNOW.

Sorry, I didn't mean to go on, but I guess I had a few more things to say.

Karl

Adunaphel wrote:I agree with you John up to a point.

[SNIP]

Sorry, I didn't mean to go on, but I guess I had a few more things to say.

Karl

Hey Karl, no biggie - I just do what works for me. If your thing works for you, that's cool.

For eBay feedback, you can always send them an eBay PM, from your eBay account to theirs to get them confirm. That said, I won't accept any demand from a new trader to pay first or ship first, whether their eBay score is 100 or 1000. What their high eBay score does is give them the right to have my attention and consideration, where I might otherwise ignore them.

As above, you can use eBay's PM / email to find out very quickly if they're the same person as on Bartertown. I'm pretty sure you'll get an answer one way or the other. I know if some punk were trading on my rep, I'd be pissed and campaign to get them banned.

As for 100, I like that number. It's a nice round number. It's *purely* coincidence that my Btown rating is 100+.

Lastly, I totally agree about communications being key. The clearer things are, the more likely there won't be problems, or that problems are discovered before anything gets shipped.


/John

Although I will look at a persons ebay rating, in the end it means little to me (unless they have glaring "bad" remarks) as we are trading on BT. No offense to ebay-ers, but your reference there means jack all to me here. When I make an ebay transaction, you don't tell me what your BT ratings is not do you?

I will 3rd the "communication is key" statement, as I tend to be overly communicative when trading. I would rather annoy somebody with frequent PM's rather than have them think I have bailed out on them by not sending enough messages.

In the end, trust your gut when trading. If a deal seems to good to be true, make sure to thoroughly check it out before sending payment. all of the traders I have dealt with were more than willing to provide answers to my questions and IMO any decent trader should. If you are dealing with somebody who refuses to answer simple questions, then let them know that you no longer are comfortable with trading with them. (Do this up front, so you aren't a "deadbeat trader")

Now these are all my opinions so they don't amount to much, seeing as I live in Milwaukee, WI and nobody likes to trade with folks from Milwaukee. Damn you Ticknor!!!!!!

(Awaits Magickal Memories playful harassment about us Brew City folks )

maple wrote:(Awaits Magickal Memories playful harassment about us Brew City folks )

Well, now, i wasn't going to say ANYTHING but, since you requested it...
How do we know YOU aren't Jason Ticknor just luring us into a false sense of security before you strike?

I mean, he IS that conniving... and I've never actually MET you... and you ARE from Milwaukee, WI (scammer capital of the US).




Eric