How long do you give?

[npd_bigdaddy]

Ok, so I made a deal, price negotiated, person said, "I'll get that money order out to you first thing" yadda yadda........

Well nothing has arrived, no contact now for days and days, and my "hey, have you sent this or what" PM has not been answered.......

SO........how long is appropriate to label this a busted trade and leave negative feedback? Is negative feedback even appropriate? I think so, as the price and everything was negotiated and agreed, and the payment was agreed to be sent, but I could be wrong........

Erik

[NuWishA]

How many days is "days and days"?

And personally, if you didn't send anything out and he didn't send anything out.. I don't think it was worth a negative. Might be indicative of someone trying to scam, but right now we aren't set up to really put a "might be bad" feedback.. just -10, 1, and 2.

[npd_bigdaddy]

Ok, not counting the initial banter back and forth.........

He said money was going out on April 1st........

Was out of town, now money is going out April 9th........

Gave him the "what's the deal" PM on April 15th........

Still hasn't been read and no contact still now on the 19th.......

So nearly 3 weeks from the initial "I'm going to send the money"

Erik

[insidius]

Safe to say this trade ain't happening.

3 weeks to wait for a money order? Too long.

[MEDEVL]

I agree that barring a miracle this trade isn't happening. Three weeks is obviously way too long to wait for a guy to buy a MO and send it, especially since he's broken off contact.
Furthermore, I absolutely think this warrants a negative ref. This is the kind of stuff that didn't used to happen very often. The gentleman's agreement from the early days of Bartertown is endangered by the influx of people who don't act like gentlemen. It's time we start to enforce if not harsher site rules, at least harsher personal rules. You had a deal and he broke it, it's as simple as that. We don't need to read anything else in, though others may try. You bartered with him, offered something for a price to which you both agreed, and he claimed the money would be sent more than once. He never sent it and has completely stopped commuinicating with you. This is irresponsible and unacceptable behavior and we need to start addressing it as a community. I'm tired of time wasters trolling around the site. They are at best annoying users stringing people along and at worst scammers preying on those either too trusting or too inexperienced to realize it.
I will concede that perhaps the current ref scores may be a bit harsh (ie -10 for a bad) but that's the framework we have to work in. In my mind the only difference between this and what everyone would agree would be a neg ref was the fact that you had the foresight to have him send first, otherwise you'd be out all of you stuff and we wouldn't even be having this conversation. Since his intent was the same either way then I don't see a distinction. Through good sense you still have you minis but he still broke the deal and should be punished for it.

[npd_bigdaddy]

Well everything I have is in PM's, so if someone could tell me how to repost a PM here so that I can show the "chain" to report him as a bad trader then by all means.......

I'm not the most computer saavy guy out there.......

Erik

[MokMike]

I agree you have a beef, but people can commit to buy anything, and until goods or money change hands, even if something is signed, the deal is not finalized. You can buy a car, drive off the lot and return it. You can buy a house, sign the papers at the closing, then the next day change your mine. More along these lines, you can make an offer on a house, it can be accepted, then rescind it. He could have gotten bad vibes and thought maybe you were trying to scam him so got cold feet? what about sellers that agree to a trade, then take a better offer? We prepared for those to go to bad trade reports? Honestly, I don't think you have a bad trade, you still have your items, you're not out anything.

[npd_bigdaddy]

I'm out time and money.......yes I have my items, but I wanted the money/trade. Furthermore if he said he was sending and never did, that's just wrong.........

I might not be "out" anything in the long run, but to say he got "cold feet" or I was trying to scam him?? I have a 160 trade rating and 8 years on here, he had a zero rating.........you do the math........

And if he got a better deal, fine, just tell me that.......perfectly understandable........but to go completely incommunicado? Especially after 2 promises to send the money? Nah.........that's a bad trader in my book.

Erik

[MokMike]

I am not saying the person is or isn't a bad trader, but it wasn't a bad trade. Nothing changed hands.

[npd_bigdaddy]

Well I have, not including my own opinion; a yes, it's a bad trade; a no, and a "maybe it's a bad trade"

Gee, you guys are a lot of help......... ........LOL

So what's the concensus from the powers that be? Everybody else's opinions don't really matter in the long run.....

Erik

[Lost Closet]

Yeah, I would think a bad trade would be if you were told, Mint condition items, and got things that were put together with 2 bottles of zap, and a half gallon of kicker, and gave you crap when you complained,

That is a bad trade, or if you had to wait 3 weeks for thier half of the trade and you had already sent your half out,
Thats a bad trade,

I would think that since you still have your stuff, just let it go,
No scamming or anything, Maybe the guy overspent and just cant get the money up, and feels embarrassed

Just my opinion though,

[npd_bigdaddy]

Eh, I've let it go, it's just annoying, and like MEDEVL said, and I agree with, it's this sort of thing that ruins the "gentleman's agreement"

I've been on here for 8 years, and I can honestly say, we didn't have this kind of wish wash "back in the day"........

To me a gentleman's agreement is an agreement, but then again I"m old school......

I just don't want this sort of stuff to become commonplace and ruin Bartertown to the point where everybody is afraid to make deals for fear of being scammed or the other party never following through......

Erik

[MokMike]

I know someone many years ago (well, 6) who agreed to a deal with someone on here. My friend responded to a persons ad, and said person agreed to a trade proposed by my friend, the e-handshake was done, and all was pip pip. Next day, my friend had a message that over the evening, someone made a better offer. He could either match, or lose out. He lost out. So the other side of this arguement, which I asked about and did not get a reply, did happen "back in the day". Not that I am disparging your rep, because I am not. And I do wish the old handshake, gentleman stuff was 100% effective, but it isn't and has never been. That also brings up the issue of sellers who agree to a price, then demand paypal payment AND an additional amount to cover that. If you agree to a price, you agree to it, if there are conditions, be up front, because I will work that into my offer.

[Linrandir]

Were I in erik's position I would leave a strongly worded neutral feedback. It's not quite Bad Trader Report material, but it is both poor trading practice and damn annoying.

I am working on a new iteration of Bartertown Rules to close that particular loophole, and hopefully I can talk Adam into amending the feedback system accordingly.

[npd_bigdaddy]

See, I would agree with that, but unfortunately, a "neutral" ref still generates positive trade value for him. He would get a +1 in the trade rating category, which in my opinion pretty much defeats the purpose.

I'd be "rewarding" him for backing out of a deal.........

Erik