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This is a super random question but is it illegal to cast oop models.

I saw a guy a while back cast an entire chaos dwarf army from oop models. He said it was to hard to get all the models he wanted so he made copy molds from his models and cast an entire army.

After that he then painted the whole army up and sold it. But I don't think there would have been anyway of knowing if they were copies if he didn't say so.

So this goes back to my question is it illegal to cast oop models and then use them?

My guess is yes but I have know clue. Im sure I could look it up somewhere but I wanted to here what people thought about this case in particular as well.

Yes, its illegal if someone still owns the rights. (and likely do) Ive seen people do this with GW Chaos Dwarfs.

Yeah that's what I figured but if they don't have the copyright to it its ok?

Still seems like it would be illegal

Some models are "open". Off the top of my head, Moulds and Minis on eBay sells moulds to cast your own figs.

Copyright takes a comparatively long time to expire, so other circumstances in which it would be "OK" to cast copies of figs are few if not non-existent.

if we are talking OOP Games Workshop or Rackham models... then....

Yes, it IS illegal. Yes, it DOES violate copyright and IP. and.. yes it DOES happen all the time.

Since this sort of thread frequently goes south fast.. KEEP to the topic!

The OP is asking if it is legal.. not whether it is ethical or anything else.

So the next question I had was how can you spot fakes?

Is there an eaiser way to identify them then taking the metal models off od their slotted bases and looking. for the citadel mark?

Quality first. Most people who make models for themselves do not make them to the same quality of GW models. A copy of a model is rarely ever as "sharp" as the original model.

Second: Materials.
Resin GW Grey Knights? Copies.
Metal Fire Warriors? Copies?
You get the idea.

New Sculpts cast in actual lead? Copies.

There are other things that are good hints, but those are the tell-tale signs.

Eric

As a dabbler in LEGAL casting, here are some ways I've found to spot metal-cast fakes:

Doubled mould lines. Since the process of making a mould for pewter-casting involves sinking the part into clay, and then pouring an RTV silicone over it, you can end up with doubled mould lines in the new cast. These appear as thin, parallel lines where the moulds parted. \

Some casters will scrape/sand/file the OLD mould lines off the original pieces, and then cast anew, avoiding the doubled line issue. Unskilled replicators will actually scar the model with the file, and if you get a model that appears to have "cast-in" scratches or file marks, it's possibly a forgery.

Lack of detail is also a big one. Using gravity pours, I cannot achieve anywhere NEAR the level of detail that GW and other minis companies can achieve. This is because GW uses spin-casting to make all of their models. Spin-casting uses centrifugal force to force the molten pewter into a large disc mould. Gravity pours don't have the same force applied to the pewter, and so struggle to replicate fine details like ropes, skulls on armor, and even noses! Amateurs looking to make a quick buck by casting up a Sergeant Centurius model and gravity casting him will end up with lots of rounded details where they should be sharp edges.

Materials often don't match 100%, either. If you're looking at a bright, shiny, pristine Chaos Dwarf model who looks like he was polished to a mirror shine...he's likely fake. There's something about casting in a homemade RTV mould that gives pewter a shine to it. GW models, especially old, OOP stuff, tend to be slightly grittier on the surface. Old models who have been sitting around for a while should have accumulated some tarnish on them unless they were stored in a pristine state.

Sprue tabs are not a viable way of detecting counterfits. I can make a mould of a complete model, including the sprue tab. it'll have the GW maker's mark and everything, and be 100% fake. You want to look at the general quality of the model by the criteria above.

Cool thanks for the help.

joko12 wrote:This is a super random question but is it illegal to cast oop models.

Generally speaking, following the letter of the law, it's illegal to cast any models that you didn't sculpt or obtain duplication rights in advance.

IOW, if you have to ask, the answer is NO.


That is different from "will I go to jail?" or "will I have to pay a fine?" if GW finds out. It is also different from "will my opponent notice or care?"

TheRhino wrote:Lack of detail is also a big one. Using gravity pours, I cannot achieve anywhere NEAR the level of detail that GW and other minis companies can achieve. This is because GW uses spin-casting to make all of their models. Spin-casting uses centrifugal force to force the molten pewter into a large disc mould.

Remember the set of spin-cast molds of GW minis on eBay? You could make some very high quality armies if you bought those obviously illegal molds, and had the spin-casting setup to use them...

is not even making casts for yourself/pvt use illegal period?

Gaijin18 wrote:is not even making casts for yourself/pvt use illegal period?

Personal use is not a legally-permitted reason. If your purpose is to avoid paying for legal copies, then it's illegal.

Please cite source.

Do some homework: look up "fair use" and see the 4 criteria. Note that "saving money" and "personal use" are not listed.