Bartertown.com

Has anyone else noticed a lack of bartering going on here?

I am still a pretty new trader, but I seem to be noticing a trend, that there doesn't seem to be much actual bartering happen. The boards seem to be more of a classified listing to sell/trade per listed guidelines in the "ad". Then if someone makes an offer that isn't accepted, that offer often gets completely ignored with no response or counter offer.

Now I understand that every individual is different and handles each situation differently. Also, any real bartering happens in PM's as opposed to in the thread. However, do you think there should be more bartering going on here? Am I mistaken in that there does seem to be a community acceptance of ignoring disagreeable offers and just waiting for someone to make the offer you want? I have seen people in their posts say that "low ball" offers will be ignored. Isn't that a part of bartering though?

Thoughts?

yep, ive noticed it too.
it hasnt always been like this.
recently i was looking for something and had several people send me "what are you willing to pay" messages but when i told them they never replied back. i expected to hear that a bit low or something like that some sort of barter to set a price but they didnt like my initial offer so they didnt bother to respond back.
not sure what the deal is though...

There are a couple things going on here that keep "bartering" down:
1. nobody wants to spend tons of time dickering back and forth when a quick and easy deal is possible, hence offers for flat rate / fixed / FREE (domestic) shipping, and target pricing.
2. nobody wants to grossly overpay, and nobody want to be grossly underpaid. You as for far too much or offer far too little, and the other guy rightly concludes it's a waste of time looking for a "reasonable" offer

I typically bargain on all deals, but it's mostly around the edges - the basic deal doesn't change by more than 10-20%. Keeps it simple and painless.

OTOH, if you're buying several items, for a large buy, go ahead and see if you can get some bulk / volume adjustment.

Even though I try to respond to all messages, If I get an offer that is way below what I'm expecting to receive, or receive a quote that is far beyond what I'm willing to pay, I'm not going to bother trying to barter unless I really, really want that item. If you offer me $100 for something that retails for $300 that is in brand new condition, you're most likely not going to come around and pay what I want for it, so I'll wait for you to make a reasonable offer. I'm also not interested in replying to offers of $10.00 that want free shipping.


I'm more than happy to negotiate some finer details to the trade, but it's a relatively small amount and usually to try to fit in some "must have" items that sweeten the pot.

The biggest hindrance to bartering is simply people wanting to move things. "I need this off my shelf now", "I need to pay bills", or "Looking for a quick sale" are all the kinds of attitudes that have been jumping up alot lately.

I like to barter. Even when someone tries to lowball me, I simply point out that I'm usually looking for a trade and not a sale. If I'm going to bother with selling then I'm going to try and get a price that is not a "waste of my time".

For example I recently put up an Eldar army that if it was assembled it was painted, to several boxed sets that were not even touched. In my ad I flatly said that I'm more looking for trades and not selling, but willing to sell. I also added that I'm really not intrested in simply stripping the army of all "useful" models leaving me with remnants of an army that I'm looking to get rid of.

Now I had several traders only really see that last line and try to get things for less than 50% retail. Others would simply not respond if I sent them an offer at 65% retail. Now on the other hand everyon looking to trade I made extremely successful trades that took a bit of work however I feel that both sides came out completely satisfied with the trade that took place.

So from my time and experience in trading here people wanting to buy will simply not barter, and generally do not even give you the time of day again if your single offer does not match their (often times) lowball expectations.
On the other hand those who are looking to trade will often times go to lengths to haggle and barter items back and forth to find that balance between what they need and what they want.

What is really funny is when you list the items for a second time and a person pm's you a second time about the models and when you give them the same expectations. They usually do not offer, they ask "how much" and then never pm again when it is not their uncommunicated expectations.

There have been a lot of posts like this over the past eyar or two, but I don't mind chiming in here.
The main problem is that you're confusing "bartering" and "haggling."

Barter:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/barter

Haggle:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/haggle

People come on here (including many of the "seasoned" traders) expecting it to be "haggletown." Haggling does not HAVE to be a part of bartering. A barter is, esentially, an exchange of goods for goods (service for service, etc). The "back & forth" many people think of is called haggling.

Although I DO haggle, and I DO find it to be a part of BTown, anyone who gets upset that people aren't haggling with them are the sole culprit in their own annoyance, as they've come on here with (incorrect) expectations of what it means to Barter.

Eric

Fair enough Magic. I suppose my assumptions about the word Barter were incorrect.

Notwithstanding, one must admit that it sure stinks to have a message ignored. Even with a follow up asking again if a deal could be worked. But I suppose that is a much larger issued related to the internet as a whole.

Mathias wrote:Fair enough Magic. I suppose my assumptions about the word Barter were incorrect.

Notwithstanding, one must admit that it sure stinks to have a message ignored. Even with a follow up asking again if a deal could be worked. But I suppose that is a much larger issued related to the internet as a whole.

Well, let me flip this on you for a minute. (Not attacking you.) You tell us you're having no luck getting people to haggle with you without providing examples of what it is you're doing or what kind of ads you're replying to. I only have one side of the story here so I don't know what the issue is.

Does the person list a price in the ad? Does it say he or she is willing to haggle that price? Does it say the price is firm? Are they offering to sell for $80 and you're only offering $40? (Lowballing) Is there a price to begin with or is the person simply looking for trade? Or vice-versa, the person is looking to sell and you're offering trade? Does it say buyer pays shipping and you're asking for free shipping?

Any or all of these could set someone off. I know if someone tries to lowball me, especially if I say clearly in the ad that I'm looking for a set price, I will be, at best, terse in my response. You have to look at this from the other party's perspective as well. Just because they don't fit with what YOU expect to find here doesn't mean they're in the wrong.

Something Ive noticed is a trend of offering assembled/used models at 60% of their retail. In my experience, its generally acceptable to offer 33-40% of retail for used models. NIB is another story, and 60% of retail is perfectly acceptable. I always try to talk these people down, and mostly get a response even if I have to wait a day or two for it. Usually its them saying, in short, "go kick rocks" but at least its something.
Honestly, I havnt seen any trends of people flatly refusing to answer your PM because they didnt like an offer, even when (yeah I tried it) I lowballed them outrageously. You must just have some bad luck sir...
Yes yes I am a new trader, but Ive been doing deals like this long before I ever found out about Bartertown.

I would agree with HZ. I posted up a similar thread a little while ago, but mainly because I found that people didn't seem willing to haggle with me when I was the person who had stuff posted up. I would get offers well below what I was asking for, or trade offers where their side was clearly inferior, and then they would refuse to budge.

Part of the problem, also, could be the items your going for. Certain things (leman russ tanks, for example) are extremely popular, get snatched up quickly, and usually command a decent price. So if you're putting in a lowball offer on something, and the trader in question receives PMs from ten different users offering closer to his asking price, he's obviously going to go with the others. Personally, I try to send even the lowballers a brief "Thanks, but the item is already spoken for," but that's a personal choice and is certainly not required.

And Captain, I've found that most people usually offer/expect close to retail for NiB items (which I usually try to talk them down on -- my gaming club gets a 15% discount at our LGS, and sites like MWG and theWarstore are usually about 15% under retail), between 50-60% for assembled and/or primed, and below that for painted. Personally, if it's painted, I usually don't go above 30%. Even if it's all metal, stripping is a pain.

Another thing to consider is your wording, especially if it you posting the ad. I had posted some ads a couple of months back and had no bites, so I asked folks here to critique them. I revised my ads based on the critique and moved most of the stuff through this board (only taking some of the RPGs to a used book store).

As for Barter, I'll swap you a chicken for all of your minis.

HarlequinZero wrote: Does the person list a price in the ad? Does it say he or she is willing to haggle that price? Does it say the price is firm? Are they offering to sell for $80 and you're only offering $40? (Lowballing) Is there a price to begin with or is the person simply looking for trade? Or vice-versa, the person is looking to sell and you're offering trade? Does it say buyer pays shipping and you're asking for free shipping?

Yes all of these can and do affect a trade obviously. If you want my personal experiences, I can share. I wasn't really intending to share as this issue isn't that big of a deal to me (as overall I have had just fine success trading). I just was beginning to wonder and wanted to see if anyone else had experienced the same ever.

On about 2-3 occasions over the last year (so not that common), the posts I responded had no expectations on price, and I simply offered a straight up price with invitation to respond if that wasn't agreeable. My offers were not over the top low ball offers nor were the items NIB either.

Like I said, this isn't that big a deal to me, but I wanted to see if anyone else had experienced the same. It sounds like some have and some others have been on the other end.

Yeah I find that frustrating to but most the people I have contacted have replied even with just a simple no. So it does seem to be the exception rather then the rule. What I find more frustrating is someone dropping negotiations with no response. I made a post and a guy contacted me with an offer. I accepted and the entire deal was worked out. I was going to ship first and I asked for his address. Nothing. About five pms later(all of which he opened) I gave up and left him. Since then I have reread everything thing said and their isn't a hint of annoyance or of a problem on his part but for some reason he total dropped me. That"s really frustrating though it has only happened once.

Mathias wrote:Notwithstanding, one must admit that it sure stinks to have a message ignored. Even with a follow up asking again if a deal could be worked. But I suppose that is a much larger issued related to the internet as a whole.

Must admit?
Must?

You know, if i was in a more ornery mood, I'd disagree just for the sake of being a smart-alec. LOL

Truth-be-told, however, I do agree.
Is sucks to be ignored. Moreso on secondary follow-ups.


@HF1F: That's backout material, right there!

Eric

MagickalMemories wrote: @HF1F: That's backout material, right there!

Eric

Yeah it was a backout but I never took the time to write up a thread on the guy. I'd kinda hate to do that now though since it's been almost a year(I think I'd have to check).